OldRoads.com

This is an archive of Vintage Bicycle Information.
For current Discussions, go to our main site: OldRoads.com

If you are trying to determine the genealogy of your bicycle by it's features, go to our Vintage Bicycle Price Guide
which details bicycle features, wheel sizes, brake types, etc., as well as showing a price estimate for your old bicycle.

If you are trying to determine the make and model of your bicycle, go to our Vintage Bicycle Picture Database
which details bicycle features, wheel sizes, etc., as well as showing a price estimate for your vintage bicycle.

Archived: English Roadsters







AGE / VALUE:††† posted by: Mark on 4/8/2002 at 7:30:54 PM
Does anyone know where one can buy lugs for building frames? I'd like to get several sets of lugs for experimenting with some frame building concepts. I'd particularly like to get some blank lugs that have not been shaped. If anyone has some I'd like to hear from them.







FOR SALE:†††Standard bike posted by: Chip on 4/8/2002 at 10:05:49 AM
I have a 20" gils Standard bike with a tank.Don't know much
about it .But I have been told in was made in Germany.Anyone
interested email me for pictures .I think that would be easier
than trying to describe the bike.







FOR SALE:†††Sturmey Archer rear hub posted by: Chip on 4/8/2002 at 9:57:31 AM
Hi I have a 3 Speed Sturmey Archer rear hub with 20 holes on
each side for spokes.The marking on it are 69 11.Anyone interested
email me for pictures and then make an offer.







AGE / VALUE:   Claud Butler (1953) posted by: Slink on 4/8/2002 at 1:37:00 AM
I recently found an Claud Butler bike in a junk pile. The S-A is a four speed (FW), dated 1953. Most parts are original, as best I can tell. Handlebars are definitely not. It looks like a nice bike, with good lines. Is this bike worth restoration? And is there any way to get info for restoration project ?


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Claud Butler (1953) posted by sam on 4/8/2002 at 1:47:41 PM
IN A JUNK PILE!

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Claud Butler (1953) posted by ChristopherRobin2@starmail.com on 4/8/2002 at 2:21:45 PM
Check out Classics Rendezvous at the Cycles de Oro site.
Look under Great Britain and look for Claud Butler. You really found a fine bicycle.
I would leave it as it is, but if you are really interested in restoring it. Contact Bob Reid who has a Flying Scot cycle and a web page about it.
Bob does not do restorations to my knowledge, but you are better off taking his advice and going with that. Very good stroke of luck,keep hunting.
Type in Bob Reid'd flying Scot under a search engine.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Claud Butler (1953) posted by Mark R. on 4/8/2002 at 7:35:30 PM
Aren't Claud Butler bikes the most collectable variety? Boy I sure wish I could find something like that in a junk pile!

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Claud Butler (1953) posted by Warren on 4/8/2002 at 10:10:59 PM
They can be extremely nice bikes. They wouldn't be considered "the most collectible" by a long shot, except in that blurb on the classic Rendezvous site. Although they never approached mass production on a scale like Raleigh, they did turn out considerable numbers of bikes. A good friend of mine has a track model and it is superb.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Claud Butler (1953) posted by Chris Nason on 4/18/2002 at 9:14:11 PM
I have a Claud Butler of about the same age here in the UK. It really doesn't get used enough. I would be interested in exchanging photographs.
Chris Nason






AGE / VALUE:†††City Cleanup Day; I bag a Raleigh posted by: Kevin C. on 4/8/2002 at 1:18:11 AM
Saturday was our yearly city cleanup day here: the city will haul away anything that anyone drags out to the alley. Like a lot of other people, on Sunday I cruised down several alleys, looking for bicycle treasures. No Phantoms, no Krates, no Penny Farthings, no DL-1s, but I saw an amazing assortment of mountain bikes and BMX bikes that couldn't have been more than two or three years old, and most looked rideable. It was really sad and shocking. Finally, a block from home, I spotted the only bike I brought home: a men's 1964 Raleigh Sports, black, tall frame. I oiled it, pumped up the tires and was riding it tonight. It's amazing what you can find in the trash!


   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††City Cleanup Day; I bag a Raleigh posted by freddie on 4/8/2002 at 9:30:02 AM
In two weeks our city will be doing the same and I will be out looking also as I have done each year for the last five years. I have only picked up 3 bike in all this time. Nothing really great . !st year a rollfast skoot banana seat bike that looked almost new. The next year a schwinn in poor but rideable shape. When I find decals I will restore it.Nothing the next two years and last year a very good schwinn predator BMX.Keep looking. Maybe this will be the year I find that mint krate.Good luck.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††City Cleanup Day; I bag a Raleigh posted by Charlie on 4/12/2002 at 4:48:33 AM
I found a really cherry early 70's bronze green Humber a few years ago.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††City Cleanup Day; I bag a Raleigh posted by ChristopherRobin2@starmail.com on 4/13/2002 at 4:50:35 PM
Nothing but Huffy's. Not one English bike anyplace!
Sale, after sale. Like a U.F.O. flew overhead and beamed them all away.
I get a big "F" on my monthly report!
5 bikes, all junk!






ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††It happened last summer... posted by: Edward in Vancouver on 4/7/2002 at 11:54:12 PM
It seems kinda slow on this discussion area, and I wondered if it wa appropriate to tell you wht happened to me last summer. While approaching a manhole cover in front of our place, I shifted down to 1st on my bike. It went click-snap, and crashed into 4th, the little hook shaped black spring on the S.A. 4 speed trigger gave and about 1/2'' snapped off. I didn't have any replacements, and I couldn't scrounge up any old style longbody 3 speed triggers to salvage for parts either. It was either a horrible Shimano friction shifter or some serious tinkering around. I love to tinker...
After I filed the rivets off of the trigger cage, I took what was left of the spring to several metal and spring shops, actually four shops, the fourth shop I got lucky. The man brought a yard length of carbon steel spring wire, and told me that this was the best match I would find. I would have to flatten the wire, bend it to shape, and then "de-stress'' it in an oven @ 500 F for 1/2 an hour. Sounded fairly simple, but then I don't posses an anvil, and the flat part of my cheapo 3'' mechanics vice just bounced around when I tried to flatten the wire. What I needed was something really heavy, preferably bedded deep in cement, something like, well, like that stupid manhole cover that I slowed down for in the first place. I picked a time when most of the neighbors were at work, and approached the manhole cover with a 16 ounce framer's hammer and the wire. I didn't know that cast iron was so soft and prone to cracking, because I left some groves in the cover after I finished up. Bending the wire to shape wasn't a problem, but I had to guess how long the spring originally was by piecing the two broken parts together and getting a measurement. The rest you can guess, but after the heat treatment I got alot of hot tongue and cold shoulder from the family. Getting the spring back in the trigger takes the patience of Jesus, and I was happy to pound the rivets in and flatten them. But I surprised myself, the trigger works quite well, it doesn't even jump into 2nd when I go over manhole covers...


   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††It happened last summer... posted by sam on 4/8/2002 at 1:54:40 PM
I like stores where someone "makes" a part.Or finds a way to keep an old bike running even though the needed part is not avalible.Shows what can be done.(put it in the memory file)

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††It happened last summer... posted by Oscar on 4/9/2002 at 2:04:14 AM
Never, never, never give up, ain't that the spirit? Extremely well done.






AGE / VALUE:†††HELP!! posted by: Tom on 4/6/2002 at 6:02:40 PM
Hi,
I need some help, maybe somebody can tell me what bicycyle I have here, it is very lightweight (9 lbs. as it sits in pictures) and seems very old, Please HELP!! Thank You, Tom
To see pictures go to:
http://www.photoisland.com/servlet/GuestLogin?USERNAME=tman2002
password=Light


   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††HELP!! posted by Mark R. on 4/7/2002 at 3:22:42 AM
Yes, the frame you have was probably made somewhere between 1895 and 1910. There were thousands of makers for a while during those years( the golden years of bicycling). It looks like a typical bicycle that was very common then. It would have had wood rims, glued on tires, and quite possibly the hubs and other steel parts would have been silver (or even gold) plated. Probably it would not have had any brakes, and would have been direct drive meening no freewheeling. It may have had fenders, or posibly not. I have one remarkably similar myself. Amazingly the lugged, hand brazed construction techniques of those days had changed very, very little until only fairly recently.






MISC:†††RIDE posted by: rickey on 4/5/2002 at 8:32:05 PM

THE 26th ANNUAL HIKE/BIKE/RUN WILL BE HELD ON SATURDAY may 4 in valley THE annually fund raiser for valley haven school for the handicaped ..WE EXPECT A LARGE GATHERING THIS YEAR ...THERE WILL BE MANY CYCLRIST RIDEING BACK FROM MONTGOMERY'S CAPITAL 100 MILES--A 22 MILE-- 11 MILE 5 MILE RIDERS WALKERS RUNNERS ALL AGES MOTER SCOOTERS TO -- AND I PERSONALY INVITE YOU TO JOIN US THIS YEAR MAY 4 HERE IN VALLEY AL. WERE ON THE BORDER GA & AL INTERSTATE 85 AT THE VALLEY LANNETT KING FORD EXIT TAKE FOB JAMES DR. TO FAIRFAX BYPAS THE SCHOOL'S ON THE RIGHT 1 HALF MILE THIS IS WHERE ALL THE EVENTS BEGAN & END EXCEPT THE 100 MILE RIDE WHICH ENDS AT THE KROGER GRO.IN LANNETT AL.THERE WILL BE A AUCTION WHERE ALL DONATED ITEMS WILL BE SOLD TO RAISE MONEY FOR VALLEY HAVEN SCHOOL GOD BLESS PLEASE COME PARTICIPATE YOU MAY CALL THE SCHOOL AT 334-7562868 OR 334-756-7801 OR US HERE AT KNOWLES BICYCLE SHOP 334-756-7561 TUNE YOUR BIKE & RIDE SAT. MAY 4 2002 IN VALLYE AL.YOUR PLEDGES ARE WELCOMED







ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Still out there posted by: Tom on 4/4/2002 at 3:59:22 AM
I stopped by a bike shop that is in the area of our city that is the poor area and most crime in the city. The new bikes he has are in the low end and price range. The owner said he has been in the same location for 40 or more years. I talked the guy into letting me see his basement bargains. He said the basement was full of old bikes until a month ago. He took 3 truck loads to the dump. He kept a bunch of old hubs. In the box was about 100 Sturmey Archer hubs from the 50's to the 70's, all AW. Even a BSA 3 spd and a Torpedo 3 spd. I almost cried thinking of what bikes he threw out, maybe DL1's. Too late now. He had many boxes of old stuff. Hubs, seats, fenders, racks, bars, stems, and more. On 1 wall I spoted a Sturmey drum brake. He wouldn't let me get it out from behind a bunch of wheels. It did have a skip tooth sprocket and the brake was black, maybe 30's. The strange thing was it was laced to a Dunlop or Constrictor 27"x 1 1/4" rim. Beside it was another rim the same with a flip flop hub skip tooth.I did not get close enough to find out what it was. When I asked if they were for sale he said maybe. He then escorted me out of the basement. I hope I did not offend him. He wasn't upset but seemed like I touched a nerve with him. I will try again soon. He also has an upstairs room full of bikes from 1890's to the 40's. He said I can come back to see them later. I hope they don't end up in the dump. The treasures are out there but they are getting harder to find.


   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Still out there posted by Evileye on 4/4/2002 at 4:13:19 PM
It's people and places like that I'm always looking for.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Still out there posted by sam on 4/4/2002 at 11:59:58 PM
Tom, a friend(Ian V) told me that the skip tooth chain was used only on English Racing or high end bikes.Or it could have been used on an American pre war light weight.Even Huffy(Huffman)made a co-molly L/W in the 30s,schwinn and others produced similar bikes too---sam

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Still out there posted by Evileye on 4/5/2002 at 3:32:05 PM
What's a "skip tooth chain?

   Ahh, yes a skip tooth chain posted by Evileye on 4/5/2002 at 3:40:19 PM
Just read the glossary and found out what a skip tooth chain is. I call it a "inch chain". I read somewhere that many track racers used them believing that it didn't stretch , as much as, the regular chain.
I have a Hetchins track bike with Campy (Record) eqiupped with the skip chain.

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Still out there posted by ChristopherRobin2@starmail.com on 4/5/2002 at 8:11:10 PM
I have seen B.S.A. cranks in inch pitch. Also "Humber pitch" is the same as inch pitch chain. The inch pitch chain was a British invention too.

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Still out there posted by Ian. on 4/7/2002 at 10:30:29 AM
Sam, nice to see myself described as a friend by some-one on the other side of the world that I have only corresponded with, thank you. My information came from an 86 year old racer who still rides time trials with us and who trains 30 miles or more three times a week. He did his first senior race at 16 so that was seventy years ago! He told me that track racers believed that 1" pitch chain did not stretch as much and had less drag because only every second tooth was there to contact the chain. He said he used it from the 30's to the 50's but only on his fixed wheel track bikes. It does not seem to have been used here or on English bikes on the road. The 1" roller chain on my fixed wheel bike is of different appearance in the side plates and rollers to that on my Silver Kings so there was obviously more than one type. Prior to the roller chains there was also 1" block chain. Hope this throws a little more light. Would love to see some catalogue info on 1" chains. Cheers, Ian.

   RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Still out there posted by sam on 4/7/2002 at 5:45:59 PM
Ian makes a good point on the differences in chains.I have also seen 1 inch chains that were pointed on the inside.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Still out there posted by Kate on 4/7/2002 at 7:05:13 PM
Hi, Love the bulletin board. Thought I'd join in.
I have a AMF Roadmaster - Courier 3 -- anybody have any
information on this - please e-mail or post -
my e-mal is PRUNE23@MSN.COM. THANKS.






ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Raleigh Sports Model circa 1938 posted by: Nigel Harper on 4/3/2002 at 9:19:07 PM
I have inherited my father's Raleigh Sports Model bike. It is probably around 1938-39 and has a Sturmey-Archer 3 speed with hub brakes front and rear. Where can I find the serial number on the frame? Does anyone have an original saddle in any condition?







AGE / VALUE:†††Ebay BSA posted by: sam on 4/3/2002 at 2:22:41 AM
Yea,things are kinda slow right now,if it weren't for Chris's crazy stories.....well,did any of you catch this BSA on ebay.http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1089421142 That top tube binds down like old motobikes from the 20s---sam


   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Ebay BSA posted by Paul on 4/4/2002 at 11:03:58 PM
I may bid on that BSA bike. Anyone know how old it would be. It looks like prewar frame and seat. It is in great shape. If it is prewar what would it be worth.






AGE / VALUE:†††Crazy bike sighting posted by: ChristopherRobin2@starmail.com on 4/3/2002 at 12:39:16 AM
You know the little tool the sardine cans come with? It's like somebody flatened out this guy's rear mudguard and then had a large size sardine can tool and they stuck one end in and wound it around and around. You should see this rear fender on this Raleigh Sports. It's curled up in a curley- Q.

It's at the shopping center, missing seat, post, front wheel and the rear fenders is toast. How it happened or why is really strange. Never seen before and its a odd, creepy sight. Huge, huge chain on it too!
I'll bet I get a call from one of the local shops over a wheel or something. One owner grinned at me and said "I send all the really crazy ones to you, Chris!"
I rarely see a English 3 speed about town these days.







AGE / VALUE:†††Royal posted by: Dale on 4/1/2002 at 9:58:04 PM
Is "Royal" a store brand or was it generally available? Just bought one in fair condition, 64 12 with twist grip shift. Paint is fair, needs TLC, especially wheels and front hub, but definitely will be a serviceable bike.


   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Royal posted by Dale on 4/2/2002 at 3:31:23 AM
BTW, has a plastic seat bag with original instructions labelled "Product of Raleigh Industries", Parts list with exploded diagram, flat wrench and an extra crank cotter.

Front axil was very loose, it's toast but hub is ok. Wheel has a gnarly sharp bend but not too far, I've got it mostly pried, hammered and pulled back in line. Had to replace about 10 spoke nipples, fortunately had some used spares that appear to be an exact match.






WANTED:†††1961 Herclues Harlequin posted by: Dana on 4/1/2002 at 9:19:57 PM
I am looking for information on a 1961 English Hercules Harlequin "racing" bike. It was purchased for me by my parents in England. It was handmade at the factory and shipped directly to us. I would like to sell it, but I have no idea if it has any value. Does anyone know anything about the Hercules bicycle company? I can't find anything on the internet about them. Help.


   RE:WANTED:†††1961 Herclues Harlequin posted by David on 4/2/2002 at 11:58:59 PM
Is this a lightweight, i.e. racing-style, bike? Or is it like a Raleigh 3-speed? I've seen one reference to this model (no picture) that suggested a higher-performance bike. Describe it for us and someone will have an opinion.

   RE:RE:WANTED:†††1961 Herclues Harlequin posted by ChristopherRobin2@starmail.com on 4/3/2002 at 12:53:19 AM
Interesting!

   RE:WANTED:†††1961 Herclues Harlequin posted by Catfood Rob on 4/3/2002 at 8:25:21 PM
By 1961 Raleigh owned most of the larger u.k. manufacturers .. so I guess they owned hurcules as its a well known brand. Most small frame builders stayed independant, producing bikes for club level racers and enthusiasts etc, but the big names got eaten up by Raleigh.
But I dont know for a fact that Raleigh owned them.

   RE:WANTED:†††1961 Herclues Harlequin posted by Dana on 4/4/2002 at 1:50:00 AM
Yes,I was told that Raleigh had purchased Hercules in the late 50's. The onlything I know is that while living in England my parents ordered the bike from the factory and it was shipped to us, but broken. We re-ordered the bike, and because it was handmade the bike took a year to get to us.

It is a classic "racing" bike from that era. The handlebars are bent under, a hand pump attached to the frame, it has a saddle bag on the back of the seat with tools inside. The only thing that is not original on it are the tires, which had to be replaced. It is in reasonable shape, very little rust, decals still recognizable and such.

Dana






ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††2 BSA/Raliegh Bikes posted by: Michael "aka" The Re-Cycler on 4/1/2002 at 5:36:25 PM
I also have 2 Bsa bikes made by Raliegh. One is a 1974 raliegh/bsa twenty 3 speed womans?mens frame looks like a womans but could almost pass for a folding bike. i forget what the other is but is seems to be based on a 26 1 3/4 inch wheel. Its is an external 5 sprrd. Have lots of pics if wanted just E-mail me. please help me find a good home for this stuff!

Thanks and Ride On!
Michael "aka" The Re-Cycler