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Archived: Vintage Lightweights







VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Nagasawa posted by: KRB on 8/17/2002 at 3:18:59 AM
Does anyone know where I can find information about late 70's to early 80's Nagasawa frames/bikes? I believe he is still building bikes, but internet searches are not yielding much information. Thanks.


   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Nagasawa posted by Warren on 8/17/2002 at 3:33:31 AM
Go here...

http://yellowjersey.org/specials.html

They're selling some of these frames...maybe they can help you?

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Nagasawa posted by Chuck Schmidt on 8/17/2002 at 5:22:38 PM
Nagasawa Catalog, 1978 -- 20 pages, road and track models shown, the bike of World Champion Noichi Nakano. Color scanned and enlarged prints of
Pista. Color cover. $ 7

Listed on my web site at http://www.velo-retro.com

Chuck Schmidt
Velo-Retro






AGE / VALUE:   Schwinn Voyageur SP posted by: dave on 8/16/2002 at 2:22:18 PM
On the way to work this morning I picked up this Schwinn ... mostly Dura Ace stuff (triple crank, levers, hubs on 700 cm rims) but a Campy headset. Will look more closely tonight when I get it cleaned up. Headbadge is the round Schwinn Chicago style. Any early guesses on age/value?


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Schwinn Voyageur SP posted by Kevin K on 8/16/2002 at 8:18:24 PM
Hi Dave. Nice find on a really nice bike. Enjoy it ! Kevin

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Schwinn Voyageur SP posted by Kevin K on 8/16/2002 at 8:18:53 PM
Hi Dave. Nice find on a really nice bike. Enjoy it ! Kevin

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Schwinn Voyageur SP posted by Bob Hufford on 8/16/2002 at 8:33:38 PM
Dave -- nice find. Eric Amlie can give you the run down on the details, but these were from the mid-1980s. I know someone looking for one if you plan to sell it. What size frame is it?






MISC:   Rigida Chromix vs. Araya alloy posted by: Gralyn on 8/16/2002 at 1:07:29 PM
I have a question: I was fixing up an old Fuji....the original wheels were rusted beyond my capabilities. So, I began a search for some lightweight alloy Japanese wheels to put on it. I wasn't having much luck in finding anything....so in the meantime - I put a set of Rigida wheels I had parted off a Jeunet Mixte. The wheels are pretty light. So, I'm thinking...when I find some alum. alloy wheels - they will be much lighter....well, I found some....but they don't really seem to be significantly lighter. Were those Rigida Chromix (or Chrom-something) all that light....or did I just get a set of Araya alum. alloy wheels that are particularly heavy for what they are?
I will take the European wheels off my Japanese bike...if only to make it "Japanese"....but to just save weight - I would be just as well to leave the Rigida's on.
Oh, I have this bike set-up as fixed gear - I have another set of 1" wheels - but the hub is extra small - and there's no way to put a track cog....or any cog that I know of - on it....so I'm saving the 1" wheels for a later 12 or 18 speed lightweight project.


   RE:MISC:   Rigida Chromix vs. Araya alloy posted by Keith on 8/16/2002 at 4:30:53 PM
If you had the rims off the wheel I suspect the Arayas would be noticably lighter. A lot of the weight on the back would be the typical 14-28 (or larger) freewheel, which may weigh quite a bit. Sometimes the Japanese ones even had extra "guard" piece after the 14t. BTW, Sheldon Brown sells sets of inexpensive, decent factory built wheels with 126 spacing and 27" alloy rims that would work nicely. sheldonbrown.com and follow link to Harris.

   RE:RE:MISC:   Rigida Chromix vs. Araya alloy posted by Bill Putnam on 8/16/2002 at 4:40:14 PM
In addition to being lighter, the aluminum rims have much better braking characteristics in the rain.

When I bent my Rigida Chromix steel rims and replaced them with Rigida 16-22 aluminum rims the difference in weight was noticable, and the improved braking in rain was very nice. Also, tires will hold better on the aluminum rims, reducing the potential for a tire to blow off the rim.

Bill Putnam

   RE:RE:RE:MISC:   Rigida Chromix vs. Araya alloy posted by Gralyn on 8/16/2002 at 4:57:12 PM
Thanks for the replies.
The rear wheels - I was comparing them without the gear cassette. But, I suppose - the tires, the spokes, the hubs...could all play a factor here. Yes, I bet the rims themselves would be noticeably different in weight. But I would bet that the tires on the Araya's are probably heavier, the hubs are probably heavier.

    Rigida Chromix vs. Araya alloy posted by John E on 8/16/2002 at 11:03:51 PM
Old-school Araya alloy rims are not especially light, and old-school Rigida steel rims are alot lighter than old-school Schwinn rims. I do concur with the braking comments, however, to the extent that I refuse to use steel rims.

   RE: Rigida Chromix vs. Araya alloy posted by Wings on 8/17/2002 at 7:19:11 AM
Nothing shines up like the Rigida!
Nothing rides like aluminum! I like the feel!






VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Vintage lightweight suppliers posted by: Gralyn on 8/16/2002 at 12:54:22 PM
I have several places in my area where I can find vintage lightweights (mostly 70's, 80's stuff) - thrift stores, etc.One store in particular - to my disappointment - has priced me out of the water. For a while, I was picking up bikes at reasonable prices - a lot of them - mostly for parts,etc. But, in the past couple of weeks - they have jacked up the prices...like more than doubled - even tripled - what they were selling them for. The result: The bikes are just sitting there - and none of them are moving. Previously, the bikes were moving quickly - now they just sit there and accumulate. For example, there's even an 80's ladies Huffy - really crappy - that has been priced at $30. It's been sitting there for a long time! There's even some dept. store brand-type stuff...priced at like $40....that just sits there.
Well, there are other "suppliers".....at one - last weekend...there was a very old Gitane touring bike - it sold for $10....that is - someone beat me to it! But, to look on the bright side - my wife told me yesterday - that she had spotted a place with lots of old bikes....I will be checking that out! I just enjoy tinkering with the old bikes, fixing them, making them look shinny and new again, riding them, etc.


   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Vintage lightweight suppliers posted by Bryant on 8/16/2002 at 2:57:53 PM
I know what you mean. The thrift store where I pick up a lot of my treasures have hiked their prices also. And as you say the bikes are just sitting there. Right now I'm having better luck at yard sales. At least there you can talk the person down to a reasonable price.

   RE:RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Vintage lightweight suppliers posted by Stacey on 8/16/2002 at 3:32:29 PM
I know what you mean, they'd rather make budget on one sale... if it sells at all, rather than sell them cheap, move'em fast and sell a bunch.

My guess is that if they sit there long enough and no one buys any, they'll see the error of their ways and readjust their prices downward.

Here's hoping!

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Vintage lightweight suppliers posted by Keith on 8/16/2002 at 4:32:33 PM
Lately I've seen a lot more young people riding drop-handlebar lighweights on the local bike path. Maybe the Lance effect has driven up demand a bit.

   Vintage lightweight suppliers posted by John E on 8/16/2002 at 11:09:29 PM
Last week, my favourite local thrift shop was offering a full-touring Japanese bike with mudguards, rack, generator/light, triple chainrings, and cantilever brakes, for $50. I could not find any tubing stickers, but it felt surprisingly light. If it is still there tomorrow, I am VERY tempted to buy it as a commuter, so that I can temporarily retire the Capo for a much-needed cleanup and repaint.

   RE:Vintage lightweight suppliers posted by Wings on 8/17/2002 at 7:31:42 AM
I did my regular 7 thrift store trip today and the prices and number of bikes vary greatly. What was my favorite store 5 years ago, I hesitate going into now!

Mangagement changes and therefore the price on bikes changes also. If you get to know the employee who prices the bikes you can usually start to deal with the person because he really wants to move bikes. Also those stores with the high prices will have to lower their prices if they are going to move the bikes out!!!!

I saw a guy find a Schwinn Suburban today in my favorite store. The bike looked brand new. Not even dirt on the freewheel! The Schwinn derailer just sparkled! I pedaled it by hand while he shifted through the cogs and it worked great. He then road it back and forth in the isle. I played cool and acted uninterested in the bike but I had to ask him what the price was on it when he pedalled by. He got it for $12.99 (No tax at Salvation Army also)!!!! Three blocks away that same bike would have had a price of $80 on it!!!! One has to adjust to the changes! Oh, I am glad he beat me to it because I have too many bikes! The guy rode it off the lot with a smile on his face!

The weeks in September are always good after the kids go back to school! Their is usually a glut of bikes at that time.






VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Bendix 2 spd kickback hub ? posted by: Tony O on 8/16/2002 at 10:15:44 AM
Hi all,

Recently my kickback hub ( 3 stripe red band - 62) stopped changing gears and so I took it apart, lubed it, looked for any sign of broken parts, etc. to no avail. Everything looked just fine. I've been reading up on it and it appears that the hub needs some play in order to work properly, the problem is that I cannot for the life of me get the "Adjusting Cone Lock Nut AB-35" off. The site I'm getting my info - http://www.bunchobikes.com/repair2.htm - from says to use Wrench AB-102, but of course I don't have one. I was wondering if anyone out there can suggest some other way to get it off, maybe there is a similar tool out there for another purpose or bike? Or maybe you can point me in the right direction...any tips from people who have worked with these?

I really think these kickbacks are neat/cool, but they sure are better when they work

tia,
-Tony O


   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Bendix 2 spd kickback hub ? posted by Eric Amlie on 8/16/2002 at 2:17:48 PM
I can't speak from personal experience here as I have never had one of these apart. I started to pull a red band out of it's shell once and what I saw scared the bejesus out of me. I carefully slipped it back into the shell and haven't touched it since. I ride a yellow band on my commuter bike every work day that the weather permits.

From what I have heard, most of the time when these hubs won't shift the fault lies with the indexing spring. These come up for sale on the Schwinn page and on Ebay from time to time. Does the tool you are speaking of look something like a two prong freewheel remover for a SunTour freewheel? I remember someone saying that they had made one of these from a socket that had the right diameter. They used a grinder to remove material to leave the two prongs sticking out. Good luck with it. You have more courage than me. I took my yellow band to good local bike mechanic who overhauled it for me for $35.00 and laced it into a 27" Araya alloy rim with stainless steel spokes. That went into a nice light Japanese road bike frame that I found at a thrift store for $20. Changed a few other things around and it makes a nice, fairly light commuter (it will only get just so light because the Bendix hub weighs a ton!).

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Bendix 2 spd kickback hub ? posted by Ray on 8/16/2002 at 2:22:33 PM
Tony, even bike shops need this special tool as it is designed to fit inside and remove the cone. You will not have much luck without getting one. Sorry I do not have one even to lend. By the way the usual source of trouble with these hubs is a thin black band spring with two tiny protrusions or fingers that wear. Everything can look fine but if this spring has the tits worn off then it will not shift properly. These run about $20 on the collectors circuit as they are becoming hard to find. If that is your problem I have a few for sale at the $20 level. Good luck.

   RE:RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Bendix 2 spd kickback hub ? posted by smg on 8/16/2002 at 3:10:48 PM
Just for interest, what are the gear ratios in these Bendix hubs?

   RE: Ratios posted by Eric Amlie on 8/16/2002 at 4:06:00 PM
The red and yellow band hubs have direct drive (1.00) and .68 underdrive.

The blue band hub has direct drive and 1.47 overdrive.

   RE:RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Bendix 2 spd kickback hub ? posted by Tony O on 8/16/2002 at 10:32:41 PM
Thanks guys for the input. If I had some heavy duty grinding tools, I might attempt to make one myself. It doesn't seem that difficult. I'm about to drop by a local bike shop and see if they have anything that will help. I will let you all know if it works.

I too have heard that it's usually the index spring. The problem is I don't know what a new one looks like. It does function properly in that once you apply the breaks, it's stops rotating, but that might not have anything to do with the problem.

for those of you who are curious or would like to attempt to fix one yourself, this is a great help -

http://www.bunchobikes.com/repair2.htm

and to the guy who offered to sell me an indexing spring. I will get back to you on that. First I have to determine that that is indeed the problem.

take it easy all.

   RE:RE:RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Bendix 2 spd kickback hub ? posted by Wings on 8/17/2002 at 7:53:25 AM
If the part is the locknut (with indents in it) on the cog side (first item!) --
Sutherlands says to use a Bendix Wrench. A footnote also says: "A servicable substitute can be fashioned from a spark plug by removing the center electrode and cutting back the side electrode so that the stub engages the locknut slots." One also has a variety of spark plug sizes availabe today also.

Slips in 2nd? Sprocket loose on driver.; low speed retarder spring weak.
Slips in 1st? Bearing surfaces of low-speed and high-speed drivers worn.
Shifts erratically or does not shift? Fingers on indexing spring damaged or spring improperly installed. High speed retarder spring weak.

Let us know how it turns out!

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Bendix 2 spd kickback hub ? posted by Tom Findley on 8/19/2002 at 11:56:30 AM
I have rebuilt 4 of the hubs. If the nut is stuck, remove the nut from the other side of the hub. The bearings are adjusted right when the wheel spins freely, and there may be a little sideplay at the wheel rim.

Not shifting ususally means worn fingers on the spring, which must be replaced.

The hub may grind in low and rattle in high.

   RE:RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Bendix 2 spd kickback hub ? posted by Tony O on 8/21/2002 at 8:13:42 PM
Hi all,

Well despite not being able to get that adjusting cone lock nut off, I was able to fix it. I might as well share what I've learned with the rest of you. First off, I should mention this whole mechanism is pretty fascnitating. There is a certain simplistic complexity to it that I find quite cool. Like someone suggested earlier, I just took it apart from the other side - the side without the locking nut - and after playing with it for a while an getting no where, I tried re-reading http://www.bunchobikes.com/repair2.htm
they have some great info as well as a checklist for trouble shooting. I then examined the index spring more closely to make sure nothing was broken. When you are looking at it in the same position it would be on the wheel, on the right hand edge there should be some "lugs" I think they call them. These are bent perpendicular to the spring. Make sure none of these have broken off. Moving left we have the first set of "fingers" these are oriented so that they are bent slightly inside the indexing spring. Make sure these are catching in the grooves of the indexing sleeve on the transmission assembly. Just rotate the spring and you should understand what I'm referring to it. It stops at intervals and if I recall correctly, when the break is engaged it is these fingers that also stop the spring from rotating any farther. If these are fine then next check the last set of fingers also to the left. These are bent slightly outward of the index spring. This is where my problem was. On the checklist it is referred to as (b) Lack of engagement of the other set of Indexing Spring fingers with the knurled surface on the inside of the High Speed Driving Clutch. Anyhow, what I did was probably more of a temporary solution than I would like. I'm sure I'll have to purchase a spring sooner or later. I just took those fingers (the ends are quite worn as they come in contact with the knurled surface when you change gears) and bent them slightly outwards thereby getting them to contact the knurled surface again. This seemed to solve my problem and once again I had two gears. Here is a more
eloquent description of what is going on in a properly function hub -

"With each backward, and subsequent forward motion, of the Sprocket, the Indexing Spring should index one space on the Indexing Sleeve. On alternate cycles, the small lugs on the Indexing Spring will restrict the travel of the High Speed Driving Clutch toward the ball race shoulder on the Control Assembly. Every other cycle should allow the end of the High Speed Driving Clutchto contact the ball race shoulder, because the lugs on the Indexing Spring will enter the open portions on the end of the High Speed Driving Clutch. "

Just a couple more notes. The spark plug thing sounds like a great idea. I actually used some "castle nuts" (find them at any good hardware store) and just cut off the protrusions you don't need...leaving just to that will fit in the adjusting cone nut. I never did get a chance to use this thing though. It should work, I just didn't have a thin enough spanner to hold the other nut in place, but as my post should re-affirm, you don't necessarilly need to be able to get it off and you may still be able to fix it. If anyone has any questions or comments, feel free to post them. Anyone has any opinions as to which of these kickbacks is the best? Blue..Red...or Yellow? I'm just curious.
Apologies for the length of my post but I was trying to be detailed and keep it simple at the same time.
cheers.
-Tony






AGE / VALUE:   Ross ladies bicycle posted by: Lisa Shirk on 8/15/2002 at 11:01:27 PM
I purchased a Ross ladies bicycle off of ebay. It is a coaster bicycle. I can't find any information on this bike. The only thing is a sticker that says Ross Allentown, PA. Any help? Thanks!


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Ross ladies bicycle posted by Lisa Shirk on 8/15/2002 at 11:18:53 PM
Follow up to previous post: I found a picture of a 1970-77 Schwinn Breeze that is identical to the Ross bicycle I purchased...if this helps any.






AGE / VALUE:   Creaky Cranks posted by: Tim Welsh on 8/15/2002 at 7:08:14 PM
I have another old gear issue, not as scary as the 'Rev X' one below. My cheap but much-loved summer commuter bike has an old set of triple 'Super Maxy' cranks, complete with the original rings (with all those lovely weight-saving holes in them). I love the classic look of them, and like having a road triple for hilly Vancouver.

I have tightened everything I can on the cranks and rings, but still have low-level creaking under heavy pedalling. Are "Super Maxy's" just like that? The cranks don't appear to be made in a single casting, with the arms apparently attached in some mysterious internal way to the (waddyacallit) part that the rings are bolted to.

I can live with creaking, but may I have missed something in trying to solve this issue?


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Creaky Cranks posted by David on 8/15/2002 at 10:34:06 PM
I just sold a Super Maxy but I never used it. Isn't it the copy of a TA Cyclotouriste crank? So the chainwheels have long spokes that are bolted to a very close to the center of the whole rig. I would expect it to flex a little and, therefore, creak. But could it be the pedals? Or something else in the drivetrain? Or, heaven forbid, the frame itself flexing and creaking?

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Creaky Cranks posted by Warren on 8/16/2002 at 12:47:39 AM
I think the word you are looking for is swaged...somehow press fit together with heat and/or pressure? Generally considered to be at the lower end but they are often nice cranks. I run a swaged crank on my fixed club bike and love it...it looks more like a track crank than other crankarm/ring combos. And it is entirely possible that this is where the creaking is coming from.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Creaky Cranks posted by Wings on 8/16/2002 at 7:17:10 AM
I would check the end of the crank arms for any cracks.
Try another set of pedals -- to eliminate that as a possibility.
What about your chain? How old is it? Stretch out a new one next to it and see if you see stretch in your original chain. Also pedal backwards and watch the rear derailer to see if any links are stiff. Stiff links can cause such a sound also.

Then I would try a different rear wheel on the same bike and see if the sound is still there. When you get a sensation or a sound in your drive train it sometimes is tricky to tell by sound or feel where it is from because it will travel through the entire drive train.

Let us know what you find.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Creaky Cranks posted by smg on 8/16/2002 at 3:19:25 PM
I've been vexed by a similar problem recently and it seems to be the saddle - a newish Brooks B17. Pressing down on the saddle produced a suspiciously familiar squeak, and the forces that act on the saddle would occur at pedalling frequency, drawing your attention to the drive train. Finally, the noise followed when I shifted the saddle from one bike to another.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Creaky Cranks posted by Keith on 8/16/2002 at 4:24:05 PM
I find a lot of creaks are from points that need greased. Examples: saddle rails/seatpost; seatpost/frame; bb spindle/crank arms (they told you not to grease it, but they were wrong!). The saddle rails are in my experience the most common source. Grease all threads on the seatpost, and grease the saddle rails. I've had old Brooks squeek the way smg describes -- sometimes a shot of oil where the rails go into the nose-support has cured it. Finally, if none of this works, I would disassemble the bottom bracket and carefully check the bb shell for signs of cracks, as well as the adjoining tubes -- though I doubt it's that (it's happened to me twice, though).

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Creaky Cranks posted by Keith on 8/16/2002 at 4:35:57 PM
P.S. The Sugino Maxis were "swaged" -- meaning the crank arm was pressed into the spider. I broke one about 30 years ago riding a friends new bike -- jumping hard from a track stand at a traffic light, I twisted the crank arm off the spider.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Creaky Cranks posted by Bill Putnam on 8/16/2002 at 4:54:12 PM
Keith makes an excellent point about looking for creaks elsewhere. Saddles being a common source of trouble.

I would also suggest that any old aluminum crank should be inspected for cracks on a regular basis. See http://pardo.net/pardo/bike/pic/fail/FAIL-001.html for some photos of cracked cranks. I have four cracked cranks in my parts bin-two Campy Record, one Nervar Star, and one Sugino Mighty Tour. Fortunately I discovered the cracks before they failed completely. Often, cranks will not give any warning of impending failure (e.g. creaking) while in use.

Go to http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=cracked+cranks&meta=group%3Drec.bicycles.tech
if you want a long list of discussions about cracked cranks.

Along with cranks, handlebar stems, handlebars, and the Lambert aluminum fork http://www.sheldonbrown.com/lambert.html are prone to catostrophic failure. And it doesn't take being a particularly big or strong person to do this, just lots of riding, as these are typically fatigue-related failures, although Keith's experience twisting the crank arm off a spider is one that does happen with abuse.


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Creaky Cranks posted by Hallyx on 8/16/2002 at 5:43:41 PM
So I cleaned my riding shoes with saddle soap followed by a coating a leather cream. Next ride: creak creak creak. At least I knew what that was. Dusted them with talc.

Still had a residual creak, but one I could modify by turning my feet in the pedals. Lubed the clips and clip-in mechanism. No more creaks.

Lotsa ways to get a noisy bike, eh?

While I've got you here: I agree with Bill Putnam about fatigue failures, especially regarding aluminum tubes (handlebars, stems) with which I've had some experience. Does anyone make a nice steel road bar. I can get lightweight steel stems.

Hallyx

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Creaky Cranks posted by Tim Welsh on 8/16/2002 at 6:41:49 PM
Wow, that's the most responses I ever had from a posting! I am sure the creaking is coming from the cranks or pedals. I already replaced the pedals, and that got rid of some creaking. Tightening up the ring bolts helped a bit too, but not completely. I didn't grease the BB axle before installing the cranks, so I will try that. I also haven't had a close look at the cranks for cracks. They are old cranks (found on an abandonned bike), and I have used them LOTS around the city.

I am kind of betting that the press-fit construction is the cause of the creaking, which worries me because the creaking is increasing. Maybe I'll do the same soon, and twist the crank right off the spider. Oh well, that shouldn't cause too bad a crash when it happens. Thanks for all the feedback!

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Creaky Cranks posted by Keith on 8/16/2002 at 8:01:22 PM
Very true about shoes and pedals. Shoot -- the penny-loafers I'm wearing right now creak! Bike shoes can too. Also, the aluminum cages on cheap knockoffs of Campy pedals will make noise when they finally work loose. As for steel bars -- not road bars, but Nitto still makes steel track bars and I think curvy track bars look great on a road bike.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Creaky Cranks posted by Darryl on 8/19/2002 at 3:08:35 AM
I had a creaky crank which the local bike shop could not stop. I solved it when I removed the seat post and sprayed a generous portion of WD-40 down the seat tube. I believe it saturated all parts of the bottom bracket and stopped the creak. If you have derailleur cables that run under the bottom bracket make sure they are lubed where they contact the guide on bottom.






AGE / VALUE:   1950's Penney's posted by: mar on 8/15/2002 at 3:47:06 AM
My son has a bike and we are wanting to put it on ebay. We know nothing about vintage bicycles and need some help. From pictures I've seen online I'm guessing this bike is from the 1950's and the only brand or name we have to go on is Penney's. It is on the frame and on the tires. Can anyone give us some info.


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   1950's Penney's posted by Keith on 8/15/2002 at 2:06:01 PM
Try the "balloon tire middleweight" discussion group on this site.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   1950's Penney's posted by JOEL on 8/15/2002 at 8:43:25 PM
Is that JC Penny's department store?






AGE / VALUE:   ZIPP Spinergy wheels dangerous? posted by: Tim Welsh on 8/14/2002 at 10:24:08 PM
Okay, again I'm pushing the borders of what is 'classic lightweight', but I really need advice. I bought a set of ZIPP Spinergy wheels from early in the 8-speed era. They are barely used, and perfect for a project I am working on, resuscitating a lovely old Bennotto-Vitus frame into low-budget racer.

Problem is, I found a website that lists a number of bad accidents riders have had when ZIPP carbon-fibre spoked wheels shatter, and essentially just disappear from under the bike. I want to know if this was a common issue for ZIPP, and if there's any way to assess my wheel to see if it's safe. The website give mixed messages about how common the problem is, and there have been no court cases or product recalls.

Anyone know about this?


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   ZIPP Spinergy wheels dangerous? posted by Keith on 8/15/2002 at 1:58:41 PM
They are dangerous and prone to catastophic faliure at the rivets -- all spokes go at once and it's time for jaw reconstruction. There's a site devoted to this -- I'll find it and post.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   ZIPP Spinergy wheels dangerous? posted by Keith on 8/15/2002 at 2:02:22 PM
Wait a second -- Zipp and Spinergy are two completely different companies -- so something's gotten mixed up. The problems I'm aware of were with teh Spinergy Rev-X carbon bladed wheels. They were the toast of the peloton when they came out -- now you'll rarely see them. I believe Zipp enjoys a much better reputation. You might check roadbikereview.com for further comments.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   ZIPP Spinergy wheels dangerous? posted by Tim Welsh on 8/15/2002 at 5:42:05 PM
Thanks - I did make a mistake explaining. I got a rear ZIPP and a front Spinergy wheel. The Spinergy one is the concern, especially as it is the front wheel.

So, what I should do what with this wheel? Hang it on the wall for decoration? Is there any way to assess whether this particular wheel is okay, or were they all hazards?

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   ZIPP Spinergy wheels dangerous? posted by Keith on 8/15/2002 at 6:16:24 PM
I assume this is the site you went to -- http://home.interlynx.net/'pjdu/ The discussion seems thoughtful, informative, and downright scary! (The rest of you should go to it -- it's not some wacko gripe site -- it contains an engineer's report and documents numerous accidents and injuries.) A local mechanic friend of mine, who I consider a true expert, won't touch them. I absolutely would not use the front wheel. I'm not aware of any inspection a consumer can perform that will determine whether a Rev-X is about to fail catastrophically. And it wouldn't matter that much, IMO, if the wheel fell apart at a slower speed, like 15mph -- with the wheel disintegrating in front of you, there'd be NO WAY to recover control -- head plant in asphault unavoidable. I think you should set it aside or destroy it. There're lots of other aero wheel out there, many with more or less normal spokes (albeit low count) that won't all fail at once. Get one (or build one) and save your skull, neck and back!

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   ZIPP Spinergy wheels dangerous? posted by Keith on 8/15/2002 at 6:49:17 PM
P.S. he apostrophe before the pjdu in the above address is a tilde. Go to the site and be thankful for your nearly foolproof 36 or 32 wire spoke wheels (provided the rims aren't worn too thin -- but that's another story).

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   ZIPP Spinergy wheels dangerous? posted by Tim Welsh on 8/15/2002 at 7:07:28 PM
Keith - I checked out the road bike reviews web page, and there were a few reports of Rev X's breaking, but only one 'catastrophic failure' (others were about the rim starting to separate from the wheel). Lots of others say they have put a Rev X through years of hard riding with no problems.

I, nonetheless, have a strong urge to remain physically healthy, and am un-nerved about the idea of a front wheel disappearing from under me. My Rev X is in beautiful condition, with no signs of cracking. What a waste to turf it.

What about getting some fibreglass and resin, and re-inforcing the riveted areas? Is this a crazy idea? It's that or shelve an expensive (and very cool looking) wheel.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   ZIPP Spinergy wheels dangerous? posted by Keith on 8/16/2002 at 4:15:09 PM
I think there were 18 reported failures, and although not all were catastrophic, more than one led to serious injury. Although the site, perhaps in an effort to be objective (or avoid a defamation suit) stays away from flat out saying "don't ride them" I'm more than a little sceptical about the notion that you can inspect them and predict the failure. The best idea involved using a strong light, and I'd add a 10x lupe, but I still wouldn't do it. True, they do look cool -- but as of 2002 they're also dated -- almost retro! I see them at races and training rides very rarely (and then on the rear only!), whereas 6 years ago I saw them all over. So even if many have ridden them for years, the word must be out. The "cool" guys are now riding Mavic Ksyriums (not me). And there are lots of aero front wheels out there for $130 and up -- low spoke count, deep aero rim, nice steel aero spokes, not too heavy, and won't blow up (Velocity, Shimano, and even Spinergy). Or get a Velocity or Mavic deep aero rim and aero spokes and build one. If the Spinergy Rev-X even has an aero advantage over any of these, it would probably only matter at 25mph+. I don't mean to beat it to death but I'd shelf it. I'd like to see others comment, especially Steven who has lots of experience with materials and building wheels.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   ZIPP Spinergy wheels dangerous? posted by Tim Welsh on 8/16/2002 at 6:49:45 PM
Thanks Kieth. I only grabbed these wheels because the were little used, and cost me Cdn $160 (US $120). I won't be running out a picking up a Ksyrium or any other new wheel at regular price.

At least I got the rear ZIPP wheel, with Phil Woods hub. I will run that, then figure out some way to build myself a decent front wheel to complement it.

As for the Spinergy, maybe I can make a beautiful halogen light fixture out of it, to hang over our dining room table :o). I believe that one should bring one's bicycle fanaticism everywhere, including home decor. Of course, many others may disagree!

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   ZIPP Spinergy wheels dangerous? posted by Keith on 8/16/2002 at 8:07:03 PM
A rotating light fixture sounds wonderful! Or a nice mobile or hang frame tubes and/or chainrings from it for wind chimes. You'd get some comments from cyclist friends -- take it from someone who decorates with failed or otherwise useless bike parts! (Smaller bits look good in cement stepping stones.)

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   ZIPP Spinergy wheels dangerous? posted by Keith on 8/16/2002 at 8:08:57 PM
P.S. As you probably already know Zipp wheels are quite expensive so I think you still got a pretty good deal.






VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Identify a Carlton Road Bike? posted by: Richard A. Cielec on 8/14/2002 at 7:51:41 PM
I have need of determining whether or not a badgeless bicycle is a Carlton. Any experts out there or sites with photos ? I am told that if a Carlton, the Ser. No. denotes 1955; although, components are Campagnolo NR or Rec. All Reynlolds 531 with Campy drop outs. Unfortunately, at the moment, I do not have Ser. No. on hand

Richard
rcielec@hotmail.com
Chicago, Illinois


   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Identify a Carlton Road Bike? posted by Keith on 8/14/2002 at 8:34:40 PM
Classic Rendezvous has some pictures: http://www.classicrendezvous.com/British/Carltonmain.htm Campagnolo Record (intro 1963) and Nouvo Record (intro 1967) would not be original to a 1955 bike. I'm aware of a shop in England that repaints and sells Carlton frames of this vintage. They show up on eBay from time to time.






VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Small Diameter Stem posted by: Gralyn on 8/14/2002 at 3:09:46 PM
What is with this small diameter stem? I have a Schwinn with a long-reach stem. The frame is really too big for me....but I have this other bike that I put the long-reach stem on....and now it fits really good. But, I want to put a short-reach stem on the schwinn....but I don't have one small enough to fit in there. They're all too big. What was the deal with these small diameter stems? Did they only make a few? On very few bikes?


   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Small Diameter Stem posted by Oscar on 8/14/2002 at 7:10:14 PM
21mm stem. It was a Schwinn thing that started with their Chicago bikes and carried onto earlier imports. How much reach or extension are you looking for?

One way to get short reach and height is to use a stem from a Speedster or other Schwinn 3 speed or coaster. Nice and heavy and chrome too. It might look funny (not necessarily) but it has its own charm.

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Small Diameter Stem posted by David on 8/14/2002 at 8:49:45 PM
Would a Varsity have that size stem? (There's been a one-wheeled rusty wreck at the T station for well over a year. I'm sure its owner wouldn't miss the stem - or anything else!)

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Small Diameter Stem posted by Warren on 8/14/2002 at 11:23:32 PM
I have an NOS GB stem in this size...it's an 80mm reach if you're interested. I believe GB made these for Schwinn at some point in time, official Schwinn approved blah blah. Like most GB stems, they are pretty in an organic way...not all straight lines.






AGE / VALUE:   Legnano posted by: Dave on 8/13/2002 at 9:25:54 PM
Hi,
I have an old Legnano Racing bike. I believe it was from the fifties.
Distinguishing features:
Chrome steel Legnano cottered crank set. single chainring;49 teeth
Huret (pull chain type,)rear deraileur
Four speed regina cog., Legnano rear hub. (the original rim when I got it was Nisi.)
Knight with shield and sword on the head tube.
Top tube cut outs for the rear brake cable.
Universal brand aluminum breaks and hand levers.
Seat post bolt it between the head tube and down tube.
and the seat was leather, possibly Brooks.
Front hub was Bianchi, (Probably changed )
the headset is chromed steel, Legnano. as well as the stem.
there is a stem mounted water bottle cage. the pedals were aluminum quill, I think there was an I.O.C. designation on them. the last detail is the serated rear drop outs. the rear axle is actually splined and you have to roll the rear xle on the drop out to get the wheel on.
This bike may not have been in the original state when I came into posession of it.
Can anyone help Identify this bike??, its possible value?, whether or not it was made from good steel tubing or drainpipe?
any information would be helpful.
also if I were able to restore it does anyone know where to find the original parts?
Thanks.
Dave


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Legnano posted by John S. on 8/14/2002 at 6:13:23 AM
The splined rear axel is interesting and telling. It may very well designate your bike as having an early, and collectable Campagnolo rear shifting mechanism (one version was called Roubaix) that involved quick releases and levers to shift gears. Thing with those things was requirement for precise frame alignment to insure the wheel remained straight in the dropouts as the wheel moved in and out of the dropouts.

This was a 50's design.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Legnano posted by Ray on 8/14/2002 at 2:23:21 PM
You bike does sound like it was set up for either the Campy Cambio Corsa or the Paris Roubaix old seat stay lever shifting mechanism. This was either very late 40s or early 50s. The bike is desireable with all the correct parts intact and it is hard to judge the type of steel just from what you have described. Are there any decals that are still visible. They may tell a story. Look for one that says 531 in large blue characters. I am looking for a frame like this as I have the correct components to build it up. If you were interested in selling the bike please contact me. The shifting mechanism is pretty expensive if you want to restore it yourself. Sounds like a great bike, do you have photos and can you describe the overall condition.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Legnano posted by Steven on 8/15/2002 at 1:43:36 PM
How many teeth are there on the rear drop-outs? Are there 17 or 19? This is very important when determining the value and collectability of the bike. As mentioned by the two people above, this bike is definitely collectable but is hard to find correct parts for. You will almost certainly not find any tubing sticker, but can be assured that it is a quality bike. The Campagnolo Corsa derailleur dates from the 30's the Campagnolo Paris-Roubaix from the late 40's. Both were produced into the 50's. How is the Huret derailleur mounted? Is the frame a pea-soup green colour?

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Legnano posted by Dave on 8/15/2002 at 4:27:13 PM
This reply is for Ray and others,
There are 17 teeth in the rear drop outs.
yes the frame was 'Pea-soup green' or as I used to refer to it as Puke green, but use 'mint green' instead.
The Huret derailleur was mounted on its own hanger.
I have replied to the other two guys directly to their e-mail who were kind enough to give me some info on this frame.
I will let you know that I did remove almost all of the original pea green paint back in 1980, repainting it with a similar mint green color for nostalgia. The original paint had chips and was very faded, ( but was durable- 'cause it took a long time to carefully remove it down to the metal.)
I retained the original downtube legnano sticker but painted over the letters w/ new paint, had it pinstriped w/ my name added then raced it. Any of the other markings were so faded they were illegible.
From what the three of you have said, I believe this frame is extremely rare. I have never seen another one of these and only once saw a newer legnano frame back in the eighties. Most people I have asked about it new close to , or nothing about it.
I would really like to know what a range of values would be for this frame and the original components I have for it. then I might be persuaded to part with it. Otherwise I might just mill down those drop out serations, put in a new campy headset, bottom bracket and cranks, build a new set of wheels with clinchers rather then those pain in the A-- tubulars. ( great ride , horror show to fix the flats), and throw out the rest.
So please tell me what it is potentially worth and I'll send pictures to interested parties. By the way I am in CT.
Contact me directly if you would like via e-mail: dspada2@yahoo.com

   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Legnano posted by Chuck Schmidt on 8/15/2002 at 5:40:05 PM
Dave, is this what your bike looked like before you painted it?


Regards, Chuck Schmidt
Velo-Retro
http://www.velo-retro.com (reprinted catalogs)

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Legnano posted by Dave on 8/15/2002 at 6:16:20 PM
I'll state it again.
Before I painted the bike it was 'Pea -green'. it was chipped and faded. the frame eas not damaged. the Legnano sticker is on the downtube and the original headbadge of the knight with a sword in his right hand held above his head with legnano written below him, made of brass is still intact.
There were remnants of faded markings but were illegible.
The original pin striping was red and was on the chain stays and on the seat tube, top tube and I think on the downtube, and on the outside of the forks.
The serial number is BR2797.
Once again I repainted the bike a similar mint green and just painted over the original downtube sticker to make it more legible.The sticker says, made in Italy.
See the first posting for all of the components.
All of you collectors might be cringing at the thought of removing the original paint but remember, in 1980 there was no internet to have these discussions. People I talked to didn't know squat about this bike and when we first got it in the middle seventies the local bike shops didn't sell sew up tires or rims. I lived on Long Island NY at the time and there were only two decent bike shops that catered to anything close to the racing bike enthusiast.
one was Dunton avenue bicycles,where the owner, Matt Palermo made his own bikes and stocked all the good stuff too. and the other was Carl Hart which is still in existence in middle island, N.Y.
The only other place at the time with possible info was in Brooklyn , N.Y. and since my travels were limited at the time I never went there.
Hey when I was riding around with my ancient Italian racing bike and Black wool, (remember the wool clothing?)shorts and cleats, people thought I was strange. now everyone on a bike looks like they are on the tour circuit.
Did I answer the question?
so please tell me .. What is the potential worth of this bike?

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Legnano posted by Dave on 8/15/2002 at 9:52:28 PM
Chuck,
I didn't realize you sent me a link, sorry, I thought you were referring to my text description of the bike.
I looked at the picture of that 1943 model
Mine looked almost the same.
it had the same color paint, red pinstriping, head badge and from what I can make out, cranks.
But I do not recall having a white painted headtube. I am almost 100% positive that it was green.
Mine also had more open handlebars,the don't flatten out like the one in the picture. Also my universal brake levers are different. I cannot make out how the gearing is set up from the picture. Like I said there was a 4 speed regina freewheel, without looking I think it was 16, 17,19 20 or 21 something like that with a 49 tooth chainring.
the stem in the picture looks different. I would have to take a look at the one I have to tell you.
The seat shown in the photo is not like the one I have.
My seat had a long snout kind of look, I think it was referred to once as a 'swallow' style. it is dark brown leather over two steel rods with an adjuster at the nose. it had three vent holes in the leather.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Legnano posted by Dave on 8/15/2002 at 9:52:49 PM
Chuck,
I didn't realize you sent me a link, sorry, I thought you were referring to my text description of the bike.
I looked at the picture of that 1943 model
Mine looked almost the same.
it had the same color paint, red pinstriping, head badge and from what I can make out, cranks.
But I do not recall having a white painted headtube. I am almost 100% positive that it was green.
Mine also had more open handlebars,the don't flatten out like the one in the picture. Also my universal brake levers are different. I cannot make out how the gearing is set up from the picture. Like I said there was a 4 speed regina freewheel, without looking I think it was 16, 17,19 20 or 21 something like that with a 49 tooth chainring.
the stem in the picture looks different. I would have to take a look at the one I have to tell you.
The seat shown in the photo is not like the one I have.
My seat had a long snout kind of look, I think it was referred to once as a 'swallow' style. it is dark brown leather over two steel rods with an adjuster at the nose. it had three vent holes in the leather.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Legnano posted by Chuck Schmidt on 8/16/2002 at 3:11:33 AM
Dave says, "I would really like to know what a range of values would be for this frame and the original components I have for it. then I might be persuaded to part
with it. Otherwise I might just mill down those drop out serations, put in a new campy headset, bottom bracket and cranks, build a new set of wheels
with clinchers rather then those pain in the A-- tubulars."

Nice sales pitch Dave!

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Legnano posted by Dave on 8/16/2002 at 8:02:19 PM
It got your attention didn't it?
and I finally got some type of Value range sent to me directly.
but for the record, I would never mill those serations,
And you left something out. I love the way tubulars ride and handle, I just hate repairing the flats with the sewing and glue.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Legnano posted by Chuck on 8/16/2002 at 9:28:13 PM
Yeah, kinda like...

Give me the ransom money or I shoot the puppy!

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Legnano posted by Dave on 8/18/2002 at 1:20:04 PM
I want to thank everyone who has given me information on this board or directly to me. THANK YOU!. You people know your bicycles!






VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Help with Information posted by: tom Lebecki on 8/13/2002 at 7:30:45 PM
I have my fathers track bike and would like some info about it. The bike is a LaSalle purchased in Chicago sometime in the late 30's can anyone help?







MISC:   Presta fit for schrader rims? posted by: Jonathan on 8/13/2002 at 4:35:06 PM
I have an abundance of "presta" 27's that I'd like to be able to use in some 27" wheels that have "schrader" stem holes.
Any advice appreciated...each one that pops costs me $3, as well as creating nervous-inflation syndrome.


   RE:MISC:   Presta fit for schrader rims? posted by Keith on 8/13/2002 at 7:05:04 PM
My friends have said buy a grommet of the correct size, but I've gotten away with taking a piece of innertube (about " x 1"), folding it over, and punching a hole through it with a paper puncher. Fit the folded piece of rubber over the valve stem, and it should hold. In the past year or so I've used a single-thickness version on presta intertubes used with presta rims -- I'm hoping it reduces the fatigue to the valve stem-rubber junction that sometimes causes a tube to fail prematurely.

   RE:RE:MISC:   Presta fit for schrader rims? posted by Jonathan on 8/13/2002 at 7:30:01 PM
Thanks alot, Keith. The books that I have (Sloane's included) and books in general fail to give ingenious solutions to problems such as this...now, somebody will site a great book that does and I'll be proven in error. I hope that is the case.

   RE:RE:RE:MISC:   Presta fit for schrader rims? posted by Chris on 8/13/2002 at 11:32:56 PM
Follow me!
We go to hardware store, plumbing section!
We pull open little drawer, I hand you two rubber grommets with a space in the middle. You pop these in the rim and shove the presta valve thru it.
Bingo!
All Done, so long, ride carefully!

   RE:RE:RE:RE:MISC:   Presta fit for schrader rims? posted by Jonathan on 8/14/2002 at 8:06:36 AM
Well, Chris, that's easier than eatin' chicken pie. Thanks.

   RE:MISC:   Presta fit for schrader rims? posted by Ray on 8/14/2002 at 2:27:38 PM
Believe it or not, bike shops have grommets specifically designed for this job. They are grooved to fit right in the hole and are sized just to plug the schraeder and fit the presta. Any good bike shop should have these.

   RE:RE:MISC:   Presta fit for schrader rims? posted by ChristopherRobin2@starmail.com on 8/14/2002 at 6:47:47 PM
How many bike shops will have it? They looked at me like I was from another planet. And After I described this to him the young fellow said "Oh no we don't have that." He would not look for me and the mechanic who had more brain shook his head but he knew what I was talking about. A bike shop may be higher priced too. Still, Ray's description wherre it is grooved to fit right in the hole is great because that's how these are. Try the bike shop first and if that fails then go the hardfware store or plumbing place route.

   RE:RE:MISC:   Presta fit for schrader rims? posted by ChristopherRobin2@starmail.com on 8/14/2002 at 6:47:58 PM
How many bike shops will have it? They looked at me like I was from another planet. And After I described this to him the young fellow said "Oh no we don't have that." He would not look for me and the mechanic who had more brain shook his head but he knew what I was talking about. A bike shop may be higher priced too. Still, Ray's description wherre it is grooved to fit right in the hole is great because that's how these are. Try the bike shop first and if that fails then go the hardfware store or plumbing place route.

   RE:RE:MISC:   Presta fit for schrader rims? posted by ChristopherRobin2@starmail.com on 8/14/2002 at 6:48:01 PM
How many bike shops will have it? They looked at me like I was from another planet. And After I described this to him the young fellow said "Oh no we don't have that." He would not look for me and the mechanic who had more brain shook his head but he knew what I was talking about. A bike shop may be higher priced too. Still, Ray's description wherre it is grooved to fit right in the hole is great because that's how these are. Try the bike shop first and if that fails then go the hardfware store or plumbing place route.

   RE:RE:RE:MISC:   Presta fit for schrader rims? posted by Craig H. on 8/15/2002 at 5:07:37 PM
You can also just run the threaded ring from the presta valve all the way down and put it on the inside of the tire, that way the pressure is on the ring instead of the tube.I do this on all presta tubes now because it prevents the valve from pulling out when you take off the pump.Works great, just make sure the ring is inside the tire fully. C.H.






VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Dunelt bicycle posted by: Sherri Tutor on 8/13/2002 at 4:21:23 PM
I have found a late 50's - 60's Dunelt lightweightladies 3 speed bike at a Thrift store for $ 20.00 and I was wondering if you could give me any info on these bikes. I know it is a early 60's bike it has a big round headlight , a metal looking thing and a small red light mounted in the side near the tire a bell and the thing that you change the speed with is metal. I think it is a 3 speed with hand brakes. It has a seat on it that says Wright on the back. The asking price is $ 20.00 ( american dollars). I am looking for a bike to fix up and ride. The overall frame is in good conditon the only thing wrong is that it needs new tires. Do you think I would be better off putting my $ 20.00 towards buying a new bike or trying to restore this one? Is this a good bike company? Are parts easy to find in the US? or is this bike a collectors item? Any info would be appreicated. Thanks!!


   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Dunelt bicycle posted by Warren on 8/13/2002 at 11:10:21 PM
You'll get a better response from the English Roadster section but in a nutshell, it's a good solid bike that is well worth putting on the road and riding. It will last longer than any department store bike being sold. It will likely never become valuable but parts are plentiful and cheap. Well worth the price and it's an adventure into the world of British roadsters and Sports bikes.

An unqualified yes.