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Archived: Vintage Lightweights







VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   10-speeds posted by: mark on 7/4/2003 at 3:48:15 AM
i just got a whites 10-speed with 26 inch rims anybody might know what its worth and what year it was made. i also got a kmart 10-speed with 27 inch rims wanting to know what year it was made and what its worth thank you


   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   10-speeds posted by Walter on 7/5/2003 at 3:07:23 AM
Department store bikes have no collectability with a few rare exceptions. Unfortunately 10 speeds aren't the exception. 26 and 27 inch 10 speeds were all over department stores during the 1970s into the 1980s. They were replaced by "mountain" style bikes by the end of the 80s as Huffy, etc. followed the market trend.

If the bikes run, possible b/c most didn't get used much, you might be able to sell them for a few $ at a yard sale but there's no collector interest at all. They weren't very good bikes and they were mass produced.






AGE / VALUE:   Motobecane werid crank ring... posted by: Randy on 7/4/2003 at 1:53:50 AM
My buddy and I took a trip to Duluth this past couple of days to ride the Munger Trail(a really beautiful scenic ride on an extremely well kept trail). At any rate, while in Duluth I picked up a Motobecane with an oval shaped crank ring. I know very little about this old bike except that it is really terrible to pedal. I can't believe that anyone in their right mind would build two of these bikes. One yes two - no!! Does anyone know much about this old five speed machine? It is in really good original condition.


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Motobecane werid crank ring... posted by Oscar on 7/4/2003 at 2:03:09 PM
That, my friend, is Biopace. Biopace made oval shaped crank rings in the 80's (and 90's?). There is some theory that the oval shape overcomes the "flat spot" in pedalling efort as you round the top.

I've never seen them on a five speed before. It sounds like you like the bikes, and round chainrings are cheap, so enjoy.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Motobecane werid crank ring... posted by Tom on 7/4/2003 at 4:10:39 PM
There are two possibilities, either you have an Shimano Bio-Pace chainring, as Oscar suggests, or you have one of the many attempts at elliptical chainrings.

Elliptical/oval chainrings have been around as long as the derailleur. The basic purpose of elliptical chainrings is to create a higher gear ratio at a particular position for the crankarms and a lower gear ratio when the crankarms are at other positions. This is acheived by varying the diameter of the chainring. The amount of ellipse, (defined as the ratio of the diameter of the major axis to the diameter of the minor axis) varied from manufacturer to manufacturer, as did the crank positions for maximum and minimum gear ratios.

Prior to WWII there was the Thetic, with a 1.12:1 ratio and maximum gear ratio occurring at the 1:30 o'clock and 7:30 o'clock positions. Bridgestone had a set in the late 60's/early 70's with a mild 1.06:1 ratio. The maximum ratio occurred at the 3 o'clock and 9 o'clock positions, where you had maximum leverage on the crankarm.

However, the most common manufacturer during the 70's bike boom was Durham Bicycles in Los Angeles. The ellipse was so pronounced (1.6:1 ratio)that on the 56T you had the equivalent of about a 42T at the 6 & 12 o'clock positions and the equivalent of about a 66T at the 3 & 9 o'clock positions! There was about 3 inches of vertical chain travel! They are also manufactured their rings in 48T, 52T and 54T. Needless to say, this all played havoc with the derailleur system. The tension arm on the rear deraileur was in constant motion and depending on the degree of ellipse, the rear derailleurs' capacity to wrap sufficient chain was taxed. Long cage derailleurs were mandatory and the wide range freewheels were out of the question. Up front derailleur performance suffered drastically and most were operated a single chainring (i.e 5 or 6 speed).

To my knowledge, elliptical chainrings were an aftermarket item and never offered as standard equipment by bicycle manufacturers (except for possibly the Bridgestone. In general, people with a high rpm cadence hated them, while there was acceptance among some people with slower cadence.

Shimano introduced the Bio-Pace chainring around 1984. Unlike the other elliptical chainrings, the maximum gear ratio occurs at the 6 & 9 o'clock postions. Minimum gear ratio occurs at 3 & 9 o'clock positions. This is exactly the opposite of a traditional elliptical chainring. The reason behind Bio-Pace was to slow down the leg speed at the 6 and 12 o'clock postions, where the leg is transitioning through it's most flexed and most extended positions. Theoretically, this reduces knee injury, as the higher ratio reduces the leg speed as the knee changes the direction of it's flexation. Bio-pace is also notable in that the amount of ellipse is rather subtle, only the equivalent of a few teeth on the large rings, though it becomes more prounced on the granny ring of triple cranksets. This significantly reduces the strain on the derailleur system, minimizing the impact on performance and allowing wide ratio freewheels. Bio-Pace is also not a true ellipitical shape, but more of a distorted egg shape. Bio-Pace was standard equipment of most ATB and low to mid range lightweights. It was always intended for recreational,touring and off-road cyclists. Consequently, it was never marketed on the top line Dura Ace group.

Other manufacturer's jumped on the non-round bandwagon after Shimano debuted Bio-Pace. Most notable was Sakae and their Oval-Tech chairings.

Based on your description, it sounds like you may have a Durham elliptical chainring as opposed to Bio-Pace. It is rare to find 5 speed Bio-Pace, while it is the norm for the Durham. Finally, the effect of the Bio-Pace would be relatively mild for a 5 speed change, but pronounced on something like a Durham. The easiest way to be sure, is to check for a Shimano (or other major brand)name stamped on the chainring.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Motobecane werid crank ring... posted by sam on 7/4/2003 at 6:56:21 PM
Note to Tom's post about elliptical sprockets being as old as derailers,I agree. On page 16 of the book Classic American Bicycles shows an 1893 Century by Pope with elliptical sprocket.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Motobecane werid crank ring... posted by Randy on 7/4/2003 at 10:46:16 PM
Tom hit the nail on the head. Thanks a lot. It is a Durhamm Ellipitical chain ring, and it is horrible. The bike looks to be untouched mechanically and it is in very good condition(I can understand why - not many would ride a bike with these chain ring charistics. At any rate I wanted to try it and I did. Once again thanks for the information.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Motobecane werid crank ring... posted by Tom on 7/5/2003 at 1:37:51 AM
Now that we know you have a Durham, I suggest you keep it. While you may not like it, I would consider it a collectible. Change the the ring to a round version so you can ride the bike and hang the Durham in a prominent place, where your visitors will notice it. At worst, it's a GREAT conversation piece. Nice find!

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Motobecane werid crank ring... posted by Randy on 7/5/2003 at 2:25:00 AM
Thanks Tom. I do like the bike, but the Durham all but makes the bike unrideable which is OK because I have some very nice rides already. For what it is worth, I found the Motobecane in a basement. I purchased it and a Gitane, both is very good shape. I also purchased another Raleigh and I like it a lot. It is very light, has an integral derailleur hanger and Shimano Dropouts. The frame has been painted but I bought it anyway. It has touring racks, Suntour Vx group and cantilever(three ways to spell that according to Random House) brakes making wide tires possible, aluminum rims and quick release hubs and brake levers. The handle bars are Randoneer(?) alloy. The headbage is thick brass and says "The Raleigh" on it. I had a good couple of days in Duluth, met some really nice people riding the Munger trail and brought three bikes home, all runners. Looking forward to going again.

    werid crank ring... posted by John E on 7/5/2003 at 3:07:09 AM
My 1988 Schwinn mountain bike came with a 38T Sugino ovoid chainring, which I soon replaced with a round 40T. As a spinner, I prefer round rings!

   RE: werid crank ring... posted by Dave on 7/7/2003 at 2:40:23 PM
My wife developed knee trouble w/Biopace rings and her low speed cadence. The best fix I've found for triples w/Biopace was to put round rings on the 2 larger sizes but leave the Biopace granny gear in place. It was , as Tom said , very hard on the deraillers.

   RE:RE: werid crank ring... posted by JONathan on 7/7/2003 at 11:59:11 PM
I suspect the "werid" Bio-Pace developed disfavor for a number of reasons, not all due to ooperational aspects. I have ripped into one set that turned out to be a bear to put back. The "ellyptical" rings are not uniform, but follow a function that makes assembly a cause for attention to details. I believe it to be a complex setup that works very well for some under certain circumstances. I can see the problems with knees, as I tended to press harder at certain points on the "clock" of the rings. My two bikes that have the Bio-pace technology in effect are MTB's that rarely run above 60 rpm in their operation. The hill climbing is another sphere of operation. Under these conditions, the lower and middle gear chainrings workout very well, better than a round ring, to my determination. The large CR is a circle, which makes for a better road pedalling condition. Off saddle climbs seem to work best. The constantly changing acceleration of the foot is not noticeable at very low rpm, high torque climbs. The Bio-pace design works amazingly well to smooth that acceleration effect, IMHO, whereas the same can't be said for other similar, but way less sophisticated applications of the principle at work. I would have to say that for any tendancy for knee problems, such as what my wife has experienced (surgery for one) the round rings are safer by a large degree. Needless to say, I get warmed up real good, before trying to bust up the steep dirt. Just my 2'c's...JONathan

   RE: not-weird crank ring... posted by Ken on 7/9/2003 at 5:45:31 PM
Check this out:
http://www.sheldonbrown.org/rambouillet/
that's ram-boo-yay to you...
Captain Bike used biopace here. Lots of folks like 'em, especially where torque is more important than speed.






VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   10-speeds posted by: mark on 7/3/2003 at 8:51:54 PM
me and my friend started collecting 10-speeds and we are wanting to know if there is a list of manufactuers who made 10-speeds and is there a price guide for them thank you


   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   10-speeds posted by Randy on 7/4/2003 at 2:05:15 AM
Started collecting recently myself. Best bet is to ut it up for dale on Ebay and see what the market has to say. Or you could search Sheldon Brown who has posted a lot of really interesting articles including one referring to the pricing of vintage lightweight bicycles. A list of manufacturers would be very long and of little use to you probably. Be fprwarned, collecting old bikes can become addictive.

   manufacturers of 10-speeds posted by John E on 7/5/2003 at 3:03:37 AM
Because of all of the small European, Asian, and American manufacturers, a comprehensive list would be VERY long, indeed. For example, very few members of this forum would know about Capo (www.capo.at) without having read posts by Mike Slater and me. One of my friends, otherwise fairly well-informed about bicycles, had always assumed that the Capo Modell Campagnolo was "the top of the [also Austrian]Steyr-Puch line." Even more complex is the cross-branding and rebranding by various distributors and retailers.






AGE / VALUE:   Huffy Bicentennial (1976)10-speed posted by: Ash on 7/3/2003 at 7:58:41 PM
I was wondering if anyone can help me determine the value of this bicycle.


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Huffy Bicentennial (1976)10-speed posted by Walter on 7/5/2003 at 3:00:27 AM
Very minimal, I'm afraid. With anyother Huffy I'd say 0-$10 if you're lucky. As a bicentennial edition it might attract a little attention as a novelty (it it's vey clean) but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Sorry.






VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Sears lightweight import? posted by: Joe on 7/3/2003 at 6:34:41 AM
Hi,
I trash picked a bike today that I thought was going to be just parts until I got it home and got a better look. It is equipped with Simplex Prestige derailleurs, AVA stem alloy bars, Rigida steel serated edge rims, Normandy hubs and quite fancy lugs, other than the Sears headbadge, it looks like a Peugoet U-08? Did Peogeot make bike s for Sears? It looks pretty original and has a set of dry rotted Wolber tires on it.The blue color even somewhat matches a U-08 I have here. The only decals on it are "Ten Speed" on the top tube. The paint is in decent condition and decals are all intact. The only thing that doesn't match the U-08 is the brakes, the Sears has Weinmann Vanqueurs and the Peugeot has Mafac. It also is labled Sears and not FreeSpirit as most of their bikes were. Any ideas?
Joe


   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Sears lightweight import? posted by JONathan on 7/3/2003 at 7:08:10 AM
I had a Sears 10 sp. with Campy gears and cranks, leather saddle and Weinmann Vainqueurs, if my memeory holds true. Steyr-Daimler-Puch made a lot of Sear's bikes back in the '60's and '70's. Look on the seat tube for a "made in Austria" sticker, or possibly it's on the badge in small lettering around the edges. Nice find. Mine had disappeared one morning, save for the front wheel still chained to the rack. The wheel was also bent from a crash, which explained why I didn;t ride it back up the hill. I have myself to blame for that stupidity. Nice find....JONathan

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Sears lightweight import? posted by Joe on 7/4/2003 at 5:35:08 AM
Hi,
Sorry to here about your Steyr, they were nice bikes.
The Sears does have the leather saddle, it has an Ideale. The headbage only says Sears acrossed the middle and Sears Roebuck & Company around the edge. There is a foil type decal near the top of the seat tube but it's faded and blistered too bad to make out. I have a few picks of an early AD and of a few Steyr-Daimler-Puch bikes and all of those have a plainer looking lug. The ones on this are not as fancy as the early Nervex lugs on say a Raleigh Pro or Competition, but are not the plain edged type found on most other bikes. They are also the same as those on my '78 Raleigh Super Grand Prix. Another choice I thought of was Raleigh, I believe that Raleigh had made some of the 3 speeds for Sears in the 60's. The odd part is that other than the brakes, if one were to change the decals and headbadge it would be identical to my U-08. The cranks are cottered Nervar, the headset appears to be Stronglight or a close copy, and the fork is French Threaded as are the pedals. The AVA stem has a 22 mm quill. It seams to have all the specs of a French built bike. I was also wandering if it could have been Motobecane, the lugs and frame are very close to a Rollfast Astra that I have that was built by Motobecane.
I also don't believe that Steyr-Daimler-Puch used a 22 mm French threaded fork?
Without knowing the history of this bike, it's hard to really say what is original and what was added, the bars and stem I would guess to be original, and the same for the wheel set. The seat could have easily been changed as is the likelyhood of the brakes, many people back in the day upgraded away from the Mafac brakes in favor of a more modern centerpull. A local shop owner here had told me that he had thrown away baskets of Mafac brakes that were removed when new. (I wish I had some of them now). With a bike like this I figure I may never know exactly how it was equipped when new, it would be nice however to figure out for sure who the manufacturer was.
I haven't heard of Peogeot making bikes for Sears before, but I guess anything is posible. If it wasn't for the fact that I sat it next to my U-08 in the garage, (and the AVA stem), the thought probably would have never crossed my mind.
Thanks,
Joe






AGE / VALUE:   HELP Please posted by: Cheri on 7/3/2003 at 3:36:40 AM
I was just given my father's 1970's Nishiki Olymic 10-speed bike and my stepmothers Western Flyer bike. I need to know where I can get the value on these for insurance purposes.

Thank you so much


   Nishiki Olympic posted by John E on 7/3/2003 at 2:57:56 PM
The Olympic sold for about $120 in the early 1970s. It is a very heavy, basic bike boom 10-speed, comparable to a Schwinn Continental, but probably less collectible. Unless it is in superb condition, it is worth less than $50.






AGE / VALUE:   SCHWINN WORLD SPORT posted by: Kevin K on 7/2/2003 at 6:06:16 PM
Hi Guys. Enjoyed the info on the Schwinn LeTour in the below posting. Owning several Letour's starting with a 1974 to 1984 I'm always looking for info on them. Today I bought a World Sport. Most of these I've seen have been of so so quality. This bike is built of 4130 double butted tubing. The bike also has a nice Shimano SIS group on it. Yea, it's indexed.$30 with brand new tires installed. This thing glides. I've no idea as to the year. Colors are bright blue fade into a silver . Yellow decals. Any ideas guys? Thanks, Kevin


   RE:AGE :   SCHWINN WORLD SPORT posted by Eric Amlie on 7/2/2003 at 10:30:01 PM
Hi Kevin, Great find for $30. Looks like a nice bike. Found it in the '88 catalog.

   RE:RE:AGE :   SCHWINN WORLD SPORT posted by Kevin K on 7/3/2003 at 1:57:20 AM
Hey Eric. How are you! Thanks for the info. Yea, for $30 it was a real find. The paint and overall quality is pretty nice. I told myself a couple years ago nothing with index shifting. So not only index shifting but from the stem to boot! Bummer! A nice addition to my ever growing Schwinn collection. 1988 uh. No wonder it looks so fresh. Happy 4th to you Eric and to all. Kevin K






AGE / VALUE:   Schwinn Le Tour what year is it? posted by: Mark C. on 7/2/2003 at 2:48:46 AM
I have just purchased a Schwinn Le Tour LW and would like to find out how old it is. I have been researching the discussion areas and it seems most were made in Japan but mine has a "Frame made in America" sticker. The S/N on the BB starts with an SD. It is a 12 speed and has Weinmann rims, Suntour shifters, Sugino BT cranks, DiaCompe 500 brakes and Suntour ARX derailuers. Would one of you very knowledgeable gentlemen have info to help? Any history or other info on the bike (what components it should have etc.) would be greatly appreciated.

Also I would like to take a moment to thank all you LW fanatics for all your help as I look over your shoulders each day. A special Thank You to JONathan as he was kind enough to answer some questions I emailed him regarding a Bridgestone Regulus. I purchased the Regulus and then a Miyata and now the Schwinn. I have a ways to go to catch up to you seasoned collectors but I know I'll have fun trying!


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Schwinn Le Tour what year is it? posted by JONathan on 7/2/2003 at 6:23:43 AM
Thanks, mark. I have 100% original eq. on my Bridgestone "Regulus" for any help that might provide. I had the bike profered to a friend's kid, but they went and spent $500 model of Trek, which isn't even better for pot-holed, debris cluttered, no climbs blacktop for exercise. I tuned the "reg" only to have a no-show to test it out. It rides great and for a "free" bike, it is beyond my limited comprehension why it's still parked in my shed. So, I have spent some time working the bike up and you have to marvel at what kind of ride you get for peanuts, man. It is more of a sport rider, which was it's intended purpose, than a road racer. The Arx makes the Le Tour after 1979, I would guess. That's a very serviceable derailer. I've run one for over a year, everyday except for sport rides, on a Schwinn "Traveler" 12 speed, 4130 tubes. It's not the original derailer, which was trashed in a nasty crash. I haven't missed a shift since putting that Arx into service. I notice the shift to higher gears is almost as good as the "cyclone", but the shift to lower gears is a bit extended, unlike the "cyclone" which pumps that chain right into the next cog with seamless precision. The SunTour front is the best I've used. A quick flip and it's right on the money solid, trimmed only at the terminal gears. Let me know if you want the complete specs. on the "Regulus", I'll e-mail. Bridgestones run like tops. Now that it's tuned up with no rider, I'm giving it a workout for a couple weeks, just for fun. I like a 25" frame, but a 23" is OK for 20 miles. Cheers, JONathan.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Schwinn Le Tour what year is it? posted by Tom Findley on 7/2/2003 at 12:57:01 PM
Copy and paste this url into your address box:

http://trfindley.com/flschwinn/

Click on the files that begin with

1980

1984

to see if the components match.

Send me more catalogs to scan. I will put the specs pages in the folder, but the whole catalog may take too much disk space.

   RE: Schwinn Le Tour posted by Eric Amlie on 7/2/2003 at 12:59:05 PM
Here is some info I lifted from a post on the Schwinn forums. You might post this over there. There is a guy named Dopey who is very knowledgeable on these.

LeTours were made by Panasonic/National in Japan from '74 to '78; in Chicago, '79-'80; back to Japan, '81 to '82; in '83, they were made by Schwinn in their new Mississippi plant; this was until the late '80s -- I don't think Giant ever made the LeTours. BTW, Giant bicycles also have a production number on the right dropout, a "G", then four digits, with the last two being year.
The last year for steel rims on LeTours was 1982; they've had alloy since then.
A few quick rules of thumb for spotting/dating LeTours.
-- Roman lettering, black OR white decals, red, yellow or lt.blue paint, 1974-'76.
-- Black AND white block lettering, rainbow bands on seattube and fork, 1977-79 (Scarlet, Pearl Blue, Violet, Pearl Orange)
-- Color AND white block lettering, color band on seattube and fork, 1979-82 (Lt.Blue Met.(rare), Sky Blue, Met.Red, Silver)
-- Chrome tips on fork, all 1974-'82
-- QR hub frt, nutted rear, 1979 only
Anything fit with yours?
Schwinnly,
Dopey

Yikes! I noticed a mistake in my previous "spotting tips" -- "Black AND white block lettering with rainbow bands" should say "1977 and 1978 only".
Dopey


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Schwinn Le Tour what year is it? posted by Mark C. on 7/2/2003 at 5:11:05 PM
Thank you guys! From what I have gleaned from your quick responses I have a 1984 vintage model. I'm guessing that models didn't necessarily change every year but every couple of years. The 1984 info from the trfindley.com site read right down to the tires like mine. This leads me to question the tires. I think the tires are original as they are "Schwinn Super Record" tires. Are tires that are 20 years old but seem in good shape safe to ride on or should I replace and save them in event of ever selling the bike?

To JONathan, Thanks for the offer of the regulus info! Actually you had given me a very detailed description in our earlier communication proving that the bike was nearly 100% original prompting me to make the risky plunge for the $8.00 price tag. I've logged 40-50 miles on it already and for a confirmed mountainbiker I am getting hooked on road riding!

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Schwinn Le Tour what year is it? posted by JONathan on 7/2/2003 at 9:04:01 PM
That was a definitive Le Tour phylogeny. I have a Panasonic, 1977, yell'r color "Le Tour II". Very nice looking bike. My '71 Super Sport is 4130 steel, fillet-brazed while the '77 Le Tour II is regular steel, double-butted except for the seat-tube (25" frame). The latter has better running gear, but steel wheels, while the Super sport has alloy wheels and steam-engine cranks. The mish-mash componentry seems odd. The Le Tour II has steel bars and the Super Sport, alloy bars. The Le Tour II weighed less than the Super Sport primarily due to the cranks. I can't think of any other reason.
Right on, Mark. Double the fun. I find that I appreciate my road bikes more after riding a MTB around on the roads and that I dig my MTB's more after heaving around on a LW road bike off-road. That "Regulus" can handle some rough stuff, I would guess. I'll give it a try, now that it's ready to roll. I've got some old beater tires on it. As for those 20 year old tires of yours. I would keep the tires, as you said, for original eq. purposes, but I would not run 'em. The cording may have weakened due to shrinkage and would be unsafe, even though they look good on the outside...just my opinion. When I couldn't afford a set of tires and when a little familiarity bred contempt, I'd run what I could get, but I paid the price for that a few times. More times than I would like to remember. The truth is, tires for bikes? They simply are weak links. I plain don't trust any tires that are over five years BP, regardless of how they might "look". Just my 2 c's, live long, ride well and prosper...JONathan






VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Vintage bikes spotted posted by: Keith on 7/1/2003 at 4:17:07 PM
Two weeks ago my son and I rode the Great Ohio Bicycle Adventure, a week long 50 mile per day biking and camping trip. I was amazed at the range of bikes used -- everything from department store mountain bikes to tricked out modern recumbent trikes. Vintage bikes were common. Examples I saw included a Masi, a 1972 chrome Schwinn Paramount, a Mercian, a Raleigh Super Course, and a Schwinn Continental. Vintage bikes were built to be ridden!


   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Vintage bikes spotted posted by Kevin K on 7/3/2003 at 7:43:35 PM
Hi Keith. A group of senior citizens went past our home the other day. Probally 30 plus in the group. The " babes " were on mountain bikes while most of the " dudes " were on older lightweights. I saw old names such as Dawes, Raliegh, Peugeot and even a Schwinn. Looked pretty cool. I wonder if these bikes were still owned by the original owners? Kevin K






AGE / VALUE:   Interesting Paint job on a Peugeot posted by: Gralyn on 7/1/2003 at 2:48:13 PM
I spotted an interesting bike in a thrift store yesterday. There was already one guy eye-balling it...I went over and looked...he said it was a good bike - and he would buy it if he had the $. (it was $35). I pointed out to him that it had been painted. Showed him where they had painted the head set, the stem, the stem bolt, even the head badge. I immediately recognized the lug work - that it was a Peugeot. The shape of the head badge was also a good clue. From the components - a U-08. It was a 25" frame - way too big for me. Someone just went really wild on that paint can....and didn't bother to go to any trouble to mask anything. But, one thing for the bike...the original wheels - looked great! If the price was low enough on that bike - I would have bought it just for those chrome wheels. Oh, and it had Mafac Racer brakes.







MISC:   Breaking Away posted by: Bryant on 7/1/2003 at 10:52:30 AM
Had a trip last weekend to another bicycling mecca (well kind of), Bloomington Indiana. My son will be attending the School of Music at Indiana University this coming fall, and his summer orientation was last week. While there, I had to visit all the places shown in the movie "Breaking Away". It was great!! Saw where the fight scene was, the stadium where they hold the "Little 500", downtown, even drove the road where the hero drafted behind the Cinzano truck at 60MPH (at least in the movie). In the Memorial Union cafeteria, there is a poster commemorating the making of the movie. I found out that the movie was based loosely on a former student who rode 139 of the 200 laps of the race to lead his team to a win. We watched the movie again after coming home and enjoyed it even more after being there. Now I guess I'll have to visit the site of the "Hell of the West" from "American Flyers".


   RE:MISC:   Breaking Away posted by andym on 7/1/2003 at 1:21:07 PM
"BREAKING AWAY", what a great movie!
Now that I think about it,that film was what got me interested in cycling and bicycles. Geez,its gotta be over twenty years now.I'm gonna have to rent that and watch it again.

   RE:RE:MISC:   Breaking Away posted by Dave on 7/1/2003 at 2:29:32 PM
Yes , Bloomington is very nice area to bike. A group from our bike club goes there every October to do the "Hilly Hundred" , 50 miles,(or 30) on Sat. & Sunday. They have live music at every rest stop and a large tent area at a local high school to shop,(great deals too!).Last fall the local vintage group had a nice collection of vintage bikes,(mostly balooners) but they also had one or 2 of the Little 500 bikes, old Roadmaster road bikes w/coaster brakes and sewup rims.We plan to visit durung the Little 500 sometime.

   RE:MISC:   Breaking Away and Am. Flyers posted by Corey on 7/1/2003 at 2:36:20 PM
Hey Bryant,

For the movie American Flyers, the shop I worked for here in Tulsa OK., "Cycles International" and distributors "CKR" provided the van and support for the movie. (I worked for Cycles in 99' to 01', and they regaled me with a couple of stories from making the movie.) The owner and son got to watch the movie production and went to the premier.

This was back when Kevin Costner was still relatively unknown, of course. The real race depicted was the Coors Classic, although I don't know what year the footage from the actual race was from.

Corey

   RE:MISC:   Breaking Away posted by Bryant on 7/1/2003 at 4:42:51 PM
So where do they ride the Coors Classic?? My guess would be somewhere in Colorado. (Duh!!)

So Dave, is there a website I can visit for the Hilly Hundred? I figure one year rather than riding the Seagull Century here in Maryland, my wife and I can visit our son and take a ride through Bloomington. That would be great.

   RE:RE:MISC:   Breaking Away posted by JONathan on 7/1/2003 at 11:07:39 PM
Seems to me, that the Classic went through Truckee, Ca. in one leg. We were up ther at the time. That's when I had a double brake failure while pushing my burned out brakes along the Truckee River. Those races get me excited to ride. I picked up a tape of the Tour of Ireland 1991 and 1992 with Lance as a rider, early on in his quest to greatness...JONathan

   RE:RE:RE:MISC:   Breaking Away posted by Dave on 7/2/2003 at 2:31:03 PM
Bryant , Go to www.cibaride.org they have a section devoted to the "Hilly Hundred" which has been selected by Bicycling Magazine as the best invitational ride of the year,(at least in past years) and they also show the Jersey design when it becomes available.If you decide to go and want to stay in Hotels be sure to call early the rooms go fast.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:MISC:   Breaking Away posted by Bryant on 7/2/2003 at 4:42:37 PM
Thanks!!






VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Bridgestone RB-2 posted by: J. Collins on 7/1/2003 at 12:55:58 AM
I wonder the best way to find the approximate current value of a nice 1990 Bridgestone RB-2 Synergy. Has anyone order the vintage price guide and does it answer questions like this one? It is stock as it was delivered except for new tires, cables, etc. Any advice -- eBay is hit and miss. Thanks, all.


   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Bridgestone RB-2 posted by Gralyn on 7/1/2003 at 1:09:09 AM
Since you said it was nice - I assume it's in really good condition. I tried to determine the value of my Bridgestone RB-1....but it's difficult. I have watched them on e-bay....and that can vary - just depending on how the auction goes. I'm thinking maybe around $300 or so for a nice RB-2 and maybe pushing $500 for an RB-1. I would possibly go less than $500 for mine....but not much less than that.






AGE / VALUE:   Nishiki posted by: Rob on 6/30/2003 at 5:29:59 PM
I thought I'd report back on my 50 mile Saturday road trip on my Nishiki Royal, about 1984...Tange #5 tubing; AR derailleurs; 14-30 Perfect freewheel; Araya 27x1 1/4 rims...(I recently threw on an old drilled Silstar crank)...so the bike is nothing special...a basic Japanese bike, but it performed absolutely flawlessly for the 50 mile trip...not even the hint of an issue!! This bike is my winter beater and I hardly even bother to maintain it...Comfortable and stable...and responsive in a moderate speed sort of way. The trip was several miles through the beautiful streets of Victoria, BC to catch the 6:10AM ferry to Port Angeles, WA, then to the little town of Sequim (pronounced for some reason, 'Squim'), then back...Sequim is apparently famous as the driest spot in western WA...I didn't know that :)...17 inches of rain a year...it's in the rainshadow of the Olympic Mtns, even saw an artichoke field...they can grow them that far north!?!...apparently the also have naturally occurring prickly pear cactus, but I didn't see any... The trip was mostly over old rail grade, some of it paved, most of it well packed railroad type gravel; some hills in the ravine areas.

I have several other Nishikis...Landaus (one of which I just recently give away)...I'm not sure of the tubing, but I think they are a little upscale from the Royal...I have an International with Tange #2 tubing which I want to get on the road...it whould be pretty interesting...

Anyway, don't pass up on the Nishikis...


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Nishiki posted by Gralyn on 6/30/2003 at 7:50:13 PM
Hey, I just happened to finish-up my Nishiki Olympic 12 this weekend!....and rode it some. It did great! It is equipped similar to yours: Tange 5 tubing, drilled crankset, but mine has 1 1/8 wheels rather than 1 1/4. From dates on the components....which range from 1980 to 1985...I would say mine is about a 1985 model. It looked pretty crappy. Heck, I don't know why I keep doing this....but every time - I forget to take some "before" pictures - so I can compare to the "after" pictures.

After I got it all back together...with all the cleaned and polished components, new 1 1/8" tires, another used saddle (the on it had was trash). I adjusted everything up....., trued up the wheels, adjusted brakes, etc....then took it outside. Wow! It looked great! Aside from those typical scratches and chips on the years of use - it looked like a brand new bike.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Nishiki posted by Fey on 6/30/2003 at 10:38:52 PM
I thought I'd toss this one out ... I picked up a Nishiki Prestige that appears to be mid-80's vintage -- seems quite light, elliptical small chainring, and bears "handmade (or handcrafted ... I'm at work and can't remember) by Kawamura." It's been relatively difficult to find out much about Japanese bikes, and particularly about
this bike.

I am very new to the bike world, but my husband has been "Breaking Away" for decades. Until he finally got his all-Italian mid-80's deRosa he constantly threatened to commandeer my Nishiki (even though it's too small for him) because he found it to be very light and responsive.

So, since it's really pretty spectacularly detailed (handwork on the eased-in lugs, matching anodized brake calipers and pads, large chain ring, etc.), and since I can't find out much at all about it, I'm naturally wildly curious to know more.

Any insights would be greatly appreciated!


   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Nishiki posted by JONathan on 7/1/2003 at 6:28:18 AM
Fey, looks like you have some illumination about the quality of Nishikis! My wife won't ever look out the window and observe that I have spun off on her Motobecane "nobly". Besides, I'm not that brave. I suspect that you have what was called "Bio-Pace" chainrings. Mine have a triple ring, with the small and middle rings being an irregularly ellyptic. That has an interesting history behind it, and I'm not sure that it has been dismissed completely as an "evolutionary deadend", as there are more than a few features that make the design desirable under various conditions and to different riders.
The fact that your "prestige" could compete with anything short of the likes of a DeRosa, speaks volumes for the quality of the ride. I happen to have an "Olympic" 10 sp. with cottered cranks (pins hold the steel cranks onto the drive axle) and I have a "Le Mans" that's modern equipped. I have tremendous respect for Japanese builders. They dialed in what the US riders wanted in a bike...light and fast. So that's what we got. The quality assurance is superb. I look at my "Team Fuji" and say to myself; "THose guys must have taken a lot of pride in their work". The "Olympic" is a cumbersome bike, albeit solid as a slab of granite, and I could see it as an all-weather, all-terrain commuter. It is not a long-distance cruiser and of course it's not a lightweight sport bike. THe "Le Mans, however, has the correct attributes for a road-bike for touring or sport. It has 12 speeds with standard chainrings (52 tooth, large). I haven't broken out into open road with it, yet. Still fixing it, but I can tell it's a fine machine from informal evaluation of it's handling and feel. I can't wait to get it going. Rob, that's some ride. 50 miles, mixed road is a good test for a ride. I'm not surprised that it went great. The Japanese road bikes hold their own. A strong (fit) rider can cruise all day on those bikes. Nice going..JONathan
BTW, I'm getting up courage to climb over a Sierra pass. I need a few training weeks in the coast range, here.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Nishiki posted by Gralyn on 7/1/2003 at 12:11:02 PM
I think the Japanese kicked butt there for a while on these lightweight bikes. They were very good quality - and when you consider the quality you were getting and the price you paid - very economical, a great value.

   Japanese bicycles posted by John E on 7/1/2003 at 9:40:14 PM
Japan produced a series of innovations and contributions to cycling, starting in 1968 with the SunTour slant planograph derailleur.

In 1971, I chose the $150 American Eagle / Nishiki SemiPro (aluminum Sugino crank, db CrMo frame) over the $125 Raleigh Super Course (steel crank, straight 531 main triangle) and the $110 Peugeot UO-8 (steel crank, carbon steel frame), a few years before Japanese bicycles became fashionable. As I learned later, the frame felt dead and unresponsive, but ignorance was bliss for 20 years! By the late 1970s, the Japanese were building lighter, more resilient frames which really could compete with all but the very best Italian frames.

Incidentally, I still have and use the original SunTour downtube shift levers, Kuokoto ProAce road quill pedals, and DiaCompe centerpull brakeset from my Nishiki, even though the frame, the rear axle, and the first-generation Sugino Mighty Compe crank broke during the early 1990s. At least some Japanese components are durable!

My bottom line recommendation is to look for mid-to-high-end late 1970s / early 1980s Japanese bikes for a very cost-effective ride.

   Love updating Nishikis posted by Tim on 7/2/2003 at 10:10:27 PM
I think I have mentioned this in a post before, but I have rebuilt and updated 4-5 old Nishiki's, and came up with beautiful bikes in all cases. My wife's bike is the smallest size International, originally pre-index era, which I updated with straight bars, suspension post and stem, 7 spd SIS (with great old DX derailleurs), and newer canti's. I touched up the paint, and clear-coated the frame. The bike is fast, smooth, and equal to new bikes costing Cdn $650-700 (or more).

I have since done the same thing with a couple of other Internationals, and one other model (their top road model, I can't remember the name) for friends. I love it every time I find a high-end old Nishiki road bike, they are worth the effort to update.






VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Info request 1973 Fiorelli "Campianissomo" posted by: Les on 6/30/2003 at 3:14:55 PM
I'm a newby here so bear with me. I have in original condition (e.g., unrestored but very fine condition given its age) a full Campy NR equipped 10 speed I purchased new in 1973. The frame is Columbus, handelbar and stem Cenelli; Record breaks Campy toe clips, Binda straps, Brooks Professional seat (like new, Campy seatpost; tubular rims (Fiame) , wide flange NR hubs, etc. Campy NR chainwheel, pedals. Original paint; all decals, badges - what ever. Never crashed. Some tools. I'm either going to restore it or sell it. Any advice or interest? What is it worth as a whole bike or as parts? I'm 6' so frame is large but I don't know exact size. All it needs to ride is a new set of sew ups.


   1973 Fiorelli posted by John E on 6/30/2003 at 8:50:42 PM
Les, the sad truth is that you can probably sell the individual components for more than the bike as a whole, which is particularly unfortunate in the case of an all-original machine. If the paint is in decent shape, clean it and seal it, but do not repaint it. Rough chrome is a difficult issue -- I have seen people sand off peeling chrome and repaint the area silver, which can look OK at a distance. If the paint, decals, and chrome are in really bad shape, then consider professional refinishing, which is very expensive and hard to justify economically. (I had my Capo repainted because it is very rare, because it fits me beautifully and is fun to ride, and because it reminds me of my college years and my first Capo. The final result is indeed stunning, but this was definitely an emotional decision, rather than an economic one!)

   RE:1973 Fiorelli posted by Dave on 7/1/2003 at 3:11:08 PM
Les, I have a '74 or '75 Coppi, and it has mostly Campy NR Gran Sport parts, which are also worth most likely more than the $475 I paid for the bike. Mine had no decals left and a laquer finish that was in poor condition so I did spend almost as much for refinishing/redecal but I plan on keeping it. Fiorelli built these bikes and I'll report back when I have finished rebuilding it how it rides.The $875 I spent is right in the range of brand new Coppi frame/forks anyway, and the bike is about 20.5 lbs. These are rare bikes in Chicagoland, I've never seen any locals on one.






VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   supermaxy cranks posted by: luke on 6/29/2003 at 11:51:17 PM
thank you jon,
the le tour will hopefully get treated fairly,in the shop
which new 2003 trek,s bike off the shelve,s!!!
the park tool is a great thing. forget it,im buying the
park tool,no i dont want a stranger tuneing my velo!!!!
i'd rather spend my money wise'ly and learn something,
thank;s for your help,
luke


   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   supermaxy cranks posted by JONathan on 6/30/2003 at 4:34:27 AM
Sure thing, Luke. Hey, my Parks tool for the Japanese cranks is the model CCP2, if that helps. The one I have has the compression bolt welded to a handle, so you only need the wrench to nub down the sleeve! Just to be correct.
I got mine at "The Off Ramp", which is a chain store here in N. Calif. I suppose a mail order house is cheaper, but I had the bucks and I wanted to get on it. It was about $15, which ain't peanuts, but I cut out a pizza and I was back even. Creative financing, I call it.
I have a lot of Parks tools, they are excellent. I agree that doing most work on your own ride has positive rewards. I consider it as part of riding, as you can fine tune or fix on the go. The mystery factor is eliminated and my courage to explore greater distances and rougher terrain is boosted up.
Goo Luck, JONathan