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Archived: English Roadsters

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Robin Hood bicycles posted by: thedarkcarnie on 9/20/2000 at 5:18:03 AM
I recently acquired an old Robin Hood. Please send any info. Would enjoy conversing with someone. Thank you.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Robin Hood bicycles posted by Grant on 9/20/2000 at 8:12:38 AM
Robin Hood was a cheaper line of bikes made by Raleigh and sold
by Raleigh dealers. Do a search of this site, or see Sheldon Brown's
site in the links section.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Sad News posted by: Keith on 9/19/2000 at 11:50:34 AM
Along with the closing of Sturmey Archer, so too goes Brooks as of 9-16-00. Get them from Harris while they still have them.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Sad News posted by Kevin C. on 9/19/2000 at 5:31:52 PM
My God! What next ... Rolls-Royce?

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Sad News posted by Christopherrobin on 9/20/2000 at 7:55:01 AM
Cyclo grar company went under but was rescued and most of the former product line is still being made and offered. I hope that something like this happens with Brooks and or Sturmey-Archer

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Sad News posted by Keith on 9/20/2000 at 10:28:33 AM
Most vintage bike parts, even if completely unavailable, can be replaced with something else acceptable, the next best thing. And we'll probably find useable Sturmey Archer AWs at garage sales or even landfills enough to last for the century to come. But leather is perishible. And there is no substitute for Brooks, in my mind. I've tried about every kind of saddle out there -- wide, narrow, ultralight, plastic, leather, leather-covered plastic, grooved, cutout, etc. And by tried, I mean more than around the block, I mean a fair chance, at least a 25-50 mile ride. None of them touch a broken-in Brooks. I just snatched up another B-17 and a B-72 from my local shop. I'll stop there -- I don't want to hoard, and I certainly wouldn't scalp one. I just want a Brooks under me for as long as I ride. I too hope Brooks rises from the ashes.

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Sad News posted by Kevin C. on 9/20/2000 at 7:29:52 PM
Just went for a ride tonight on the DL-1. That Brooks B-90/3 is a work of art and the most comfortable bicycle seat going. I hate to think this is the end of an era.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Sad News posted by Mark R. on 9/21/2000 at 1:46:37 PM
Noooooooooooo! Damn it! A world without Brooks saddles isn't worth riding in! Some one must save them! After all didn't they used to belong to someone else before S/A bought them? GOD! Can you imagine never being able to get another new Brooksy? It really is disgusting how the world changes.

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Sad News posted by Dennis V. on 9/21/2000 at 6:59:35 PM
Sad indeed. The folks at S-A, all 300 of them, were tossed out of their jobs with 10 minutes notice. If you want to read the gory details, go to the local newspaper's on-line edition at http://www.thisisnottingham.co.uk/. Hit archives and enter Sturmey Archer for a search. Two stories will pop up. Brooks may be reorganized if somebody out there has at least some brains. I just can't believe this happening with the bicycle market the way it is today.

MISC:   Workshop posted by: Wings on 9/19/2000 at 2:26:28 AM
I have been doing a major reorganization of my bike workshop and parts and bike storage area in my two car garage (cars don't go there!). I love my garage and the stuff in it.
I am stuck on a good method of storing fenders in a small area. I use large pvc pipe for straight bar handlebars but do you know of a good way to store 20 cruiser bars in a small area? Then there are the old time wire baskets with the long hanging connections--have you found a good way of storing them? Those are the items that bug me and I would appreciate your ideas.
I also think it would be great to have a workshop picture area as a way of getting ideas. Sheldon's color coding of wrenches and sockets has been a big help.

AGE / VALUE:    posted by: 24 " girls Raleigh on 9/18/2000 at 3:44:38 PM
Hey, I have this 24" wheel Raleigh space rider bike that I was going to fix up some for my little girl, but she says she doesn't like it. Does anyone want it? I would be willing to sell it dirt cheap since it needs an indicator chain, and some adjustment. It looks OK but is pretty well used, although everything is there and usable as is. I don't want to open up the hub and grease it etc...if she's not even gonna ride it you know?
If you'd like it for your own little girl, we can make some arraingement. Thanks! Mark R.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:    posted by Keith on 9/19/2000 at 6:23:15 AM
This might be great for my 7-year old daughter.

MISC:   Improvements in our archive search engines posted by: VVVintage Vintage Bicycles at OldRoads.com on 9/17/2000 at 9:10:03 AM
We've just made some more changes to the search engines of our Discussion Area Archives.
You can now search our entire 5 years of archives, from 1995 to the present.

Click on "Search Our Discussion Area Archives" in the dropdown list at the top of this page, or access the Vintage Bicycle Archive Search engines from our home page.

Vin - VVVintage Vintage Bicycles at OldRoads.com

AGE / VALUE:   Dwain Wood is this your bike? posted by: Grant on 9/16/2000 at 2:07:27 PM
Go to Ebay and check out the picture and description.
I think this is the same as your bike, a Raleigh DL1
Item #438821970
Color is given as green, this is an error, it is actually black.

AGE / VALUE:   Dwain Wood is this your bike? posted by: Grant on 9/16/2000 at 2:07:27 PM
Go to Ebay and check out the picture and description.
I think this is the same as your bike, a Raleigh DL1
Item #438821970

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Dwain Wood is this your bike? posted by Dwain Wood on 9/16/2000 at 7:23:59 PM
The bicycle in ebay item # 438821970 looks identical to the one I have except mine has black handle grips. You can't see the tail of his rear fender but mine is white at the bottom with a white reflector housing. My reflector lens is missing. My bike also has the three speed shifter on top of the right side handlebar. On one of Sheldon's sites I saw a mens bike that looked like this and it had the white on the tail fender but I don't remember where I saw it. Thanks for sticking with me on this. Does this help you narrow down the age of the bike? Thanks again!

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Dwain Wood is this your bike? posted by Grant on 9/17/2000 at 11:11:45 AM
It does not help much because these bikes were made for so
many years nearly unchanged. It could be anywhere from the
30's to the 70's. Brown's site has more details. By the law
averages it is most likely from the 50's because they are the
most common today. But by the law of averages I thought it was
a Sport model too.

Serial number is on the top tube below the seat. This may help,
we have a list of numbers from 1965 back to the 1800's.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Dwain Wood is this your bike? posted by Grant on 9/17/2000 at 11:15:40 AM
Your number 055754 has no letter code but it is fairly low so
it is probably from the late 60's. Unless it is really really
old. Check the number list for Raleigh on this site.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Dwain Wood is this your bike? posted by Dwain Wood on 9/20/2000 at 6:45:10 AM
I found some more dating info. The bike has Raleigh pedals.They were made in Germany. The chart said Raleigh pedals dated from 1945 to 1965. It has a plastic clamp on pulley. They date from 1962 to 1976. With this info, the bike would date between 1962 and 1965. The serial number under the seat does not match these dates from what I understand. That number is 055754 with no letters. Are we gaining ground?

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Dwain Wood is this your bike? posted by Grant on 9/20/2000 at 8:08:34 AM
I have 2 bikes made in 1973 with Raleigh logo pedals made in Germany.
I think the pedals were made in the Raleigh plant from 1945
to 1965, after that they were imported.

Your serial number seems to be after 1966 but well before 1972.
The 32-40 spoke wheels were replaced by 36-36 in 1970. This places
your bike between 1967 and 1969. If you call it a 68 you won't be far wrong.

I still can't believe there is no date on the rear hub.On yours it will not
be where Brown's picture shows it. It will be to the left of the Sturmey Archer
emblem, and it will be turned at right angles to it.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Dwain Wood is this your bike? posted by Dwain Wood on 9/20/2000 at 8:17:17 PM
At the bottom left side of the AW triangle it looks like a number 1 with the top of the number 1 pointing toward the triangle. It is sideways compared to the other writing. There are not any other numbers there. I thought the 1 was a scratch. Thanks for your replies, Grant!

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Dwain Wood is this your bike? posted by Dwain Wood on 9/20/2000 at 8:54:42 PM
I just read where they quit making Brooks saddles. I looked up the Harris Cyclery site where they sell them and saw a picture of the seat on my bike. It looks like the picture of the B-72.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   sturmey-archer to close posted by: Richard on 9/16/2000 at 11:55:35 AM
I've just heard on the radio that sturmey-archer is to close in nottingham

AGE / VALUE:   I really have to know!!!!!!!! posted by: Keith on 9/13/2000 at 8:03:10 AM
Value! Ugh! This time it's serious. Well it turns out the two 1975 Superbes owned by the former bike shop owner are not matching, nor are they still in the box -- they are merely in excellent condition, and complete, including correct original racks, keys for the locking forks, etc. He wants me to make an offer. My conscience weighs too heavily on me -- I really want to be fair! He also has a Raleigh Twenty that actually is in the box, as well as a ladies Sprite still in the box (ugh). He also has lotsa spare Raleigh parts, including some rod brake parts. He'll send me a list. Please, someone give me a clue on this subject we all seem to avoid here -- what's a fair "wholesale" and fair "retail" for these bikes?

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   I really have to know!!!!!!!! posted by Warren on 9/13/2000 at 6:07:18 PM
Its tough Keith...all you can do is assess what they're worth to you. As far as I'm concerned there is no retail or wholesale value on 30 year-old NOS bikes...only what the market will pay. That Twenty may have cost $80 new in the early 70's, so what's it worth now? If I was flush I might drop $200 on it...others would pay more OR less. I'd still lowball the three bikes for a couple of hundred (more or less) and see what he says. I know you could resell one or two of the bikes at a fair price that would make you a modest return. Superbes in excellent condition are really desireable.

Good luck!

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   I really have to know!!!!!!!! posted by Keith on 9/14/2000 at 6:57:24 AM
Thank Warren. You're right about the wholesale/retail -- I guess I always hope there's a fair but lower price that a "dealer" (not that I'm one) would pay with the idea of reselling. Quite frankly I have enough English 3-speeds at the moment, and if I get more I'd rather have something unusual and pre-1960. The 1975 Superbe does not appeal to me that much as a "rider" because in my opinion by 1975 the chrome on Raleighs was downright poor. Anyway, I'd be interested in others' opinions too, and feel free to email me if you are interested in any of these bikes.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   I really have to know!!!!!!!! posted by Art on 9/14/2000 at 8:15:28 AM
This is one area of collecting that I hate. I sort of make it a policy to not make an offer. I really want the seller to tell me what their lowest price is. Then I buy it or not. I went up north once to guy's place where he had a bunch of bikes for sale. He had about fifty bikes on the ground, but way up in the rafters was an Italian road bike. Ideore. 1949. I asked him how much. He kept asking me what I'd offer. I didn't want to say anything until I saw it, so he and I worked about 45 minutes getting the bike down. At one point I was on a thirty foot ladder helping him. When we got it down, he wouldn't say what he wanted. Finally, my family waiting patiently for me in the car, I said something like $300. The bike was really beat, worn saddle, rusty, but I was born in 49, you know how that goes. He starts screaming that my offer isn't half what he'd take for the bike. He couldn't take less than $900. Gee, if he couldn't take less when it was on the ground, why didn't he tell me that before we went to all that work? From that point I've try to stay away from the bidding wars. That being said, if there is a bike(s) that you want and the guy has to have you bid, my only advice is to bid a price that you know you can get easily if you have to unload the bikes easily. If a guy would snap up a new twenty in the box quickly for a hundred, then I'd offer a hundred. This guy's a dealer. I would imagine he has in his head a lowest price he take for the stuff. I've just gotten tied of paying too much for bikes that are cool in some sense but not cool enough to someone else to get my money back.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   I really have to know!!!!!!!! posted by Mike on 9/14/2000 at 8:48:24 PM
I agree with that. It's up to the seller to price his stuff. He knows what he has in it, after all. If that doesn't work, low-ball it. No buyer buyer should be expected to make a bad deal for himself.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   I really have to know!!!!!!!! posted by Wings on 9/15/2000 at 11:49:51 PM
It is very difficult to deal with prices when emotions are involved. The feeling of "It is a treasure, I have got to have it, this may be my last chance ever!" or the feeling or rescuing the bike from unknown future disaster and giving it a nice spot in my living room all leads to paying a higher price and most likely never turning a profit on a resale--if there is one.

What are they worth to you?
Do you really have a true need for them?
How large is your collection? Will these take storage room away from the purchase of a treasure next year?

I saw a 50's tandem (Rollfast) 30 feet up on the side of a feed barn two years ago. The guy would only take over $1000 for it. 6 months later I found the same style of bike in the back of an antique shop and I paid $70 for it.

Definitly LOW BALL THE FIRST OFFER! Make it so it would be a good deal for you. Force him to counter and then settle in the middle somewhere! Did I not see 20 folders going for around $300 this year on Ebay?

Good luck!

AGE / VALUE:   "FLYING JET" BIKE??? posted by: STEVEN on 9/12/2000 at 9:16:13 PM

AGE / VALUE:   ladies Raleigh bicycle posted by: Dwain Wood on 9/11/2000 at 5:25:18 PM
I need help dating a ladies Raleigh bicycle.Check previous message dated 9/6/00 for details.Thanks for your help!

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   ladies Raleigh bicycle posted by Grant on 9/11/2000 at 7:54:06 PM
Check out Sheldon Brown's Raleigh site.http://www.sheldonbrown.com/english-3.html
Lots of info on the 3 speed models.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   ladies Raleigh bicycle posted by Grant on 9/11/2000 at 8:00:32 PM
The date stamp appears next to the Sturmey-Archer emblem,
on the left, and it runs 90 degrees to the emblem. It is in
the form of 2 numbers example 2 68 would be a hub made in
February 1968.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   ladies Raleigh bicycle posted by Grant on 9/11/2000 at 8:34:32 PM
See also Brown's article on dating your Raleigh

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   ladies Raleigh bicycle posted by Dwain Wood on 9/12/2000 at 6:12:25 PM
I looked again at the hub. On the left side of the AW triangle is the number 1. The top of the number 1 is pointed toward the bottom left hand corner of the AW triangle. There are not any more numbers on it. I thought the number 1 was a scratch but it does look like a sideways number 1. Please reply. Thanks!

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   ladies Raleigh bicycle posted by Grant on 9/12/2000 at 7:19:07 PM
Did you look at Sheldon Brown's site? He has an article on dating
Raleighs by their characteristics i.e. 32 spoke wheels were used
up to a certain date, 36 spoke came after. Also the model of hub can
be significant. He has a whole chart of different features.

Your machine may be quite old, from the '60s or earlier. There is a chart
of serial numbers on this site but they only go up to 1965 or so.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   ladies Raleigh bicycle posted by Grant on 9/12/2000 at 7:47:51 PM
The serial number you gave is a six digit number with no letters
after it. All the serial numbers on the list on this site have
a letter suffix. However they only go up to 1965. I know that after
that, they went to a six digit number. I have a Raleigh Superbe #91526
with a hub dated 2 73. Your number is quite a bit below that. Also
the 32-40 spoke wheels were changed to 36-36 by 1970. From this I infer
that your machine was made some time between 1965 and 1970. As I do not have
your bike in front of me, that is all I can tell from looking up the web sites
I told you about. Since you have the bike in front of you, you could find
out for yourself if you looked at the websites.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   ladies Raleigh bicycle posted by Grant on 9/12/2000 at 7:49:27 PM
Should be serial #915726

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   ladies Raleigh bicycle posted by Grant on 9/12/2000 at 8:21:32 PM
Is there a name on the chain guard? It should say "Raleigh Sport".
The leather Brooks saddle was not used on the Sport but it could have
been added by the owner. That saddle was used on the mens' "Superbe"
model. If you had one of those you would know it. Your bike would have a
fork lock, Dynohub, headlight, tailight and luggage rack.

Raleigh was the leading English bicycle maker for many years. Their
3 speed machines were regarded as high quality transportation, good for
years of hard wear with minimum upkeep. Many people today prefer them for
suburb, town and city use and commuting.

Over the years they sold thousands and thousands of bikes in the United States
and Canada. Often they were retailed by department store chains etc. under their
own brand name. Such brands as "Hiawatha" "Robin Hood" and "Supercycle" were made by
Raleigh. The frames, wheels,pedals, and fenders are alike and interchangeable. The
non Raleigh brands had a different shaped fork, front sprocket, and wire fender supports
instead of flat steel strips. The Raleigh was always the most expensive, top quality
brand. The others were equally good in terms of durability but the accessories like
seats, fender brackets etc were cheaper.

What you probably have is a Raleigh Sports of around 1968 vintage. It is a good runabout
and worth keeping but it has no great money value. In good condition, possibly $50 to $100.
Ladies' models are easier to find in good shape than mens' and are not in high demand.

There is one thing that bothers me and that is the black paint job. Usually they are green,
but I have heard of brown ones and I have a grey one, though they are later models. With the
black paint and Brooks saddle it is possible you have something rather rarer namely a DL-1.
Does it have brakes with a rod that pulls them up against the rim? Or does it have
brakes worked by a wire that squeeze the rim?

   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   ladies Raleigh bicycle posted by Dwain Wood on 9/15/2000 at 4:27:46 AM
Sorry I didn`t reply sooner. I haven`t had time to check for messages. Thanks for your replies. The bike does have rod brakes, and the number under the seat is 055754.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   ladies Raleigh bicycle posted by ChristopherRobin on 9/15/2000 at 6:29:43 AM
The Raleigh Sports also came in yellow.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   ladies Raleigh bicycle posted by Dwain Wood on 9/15/2000 at 9:04:34 AM
The chainguard only says RALEIGH.It does not have a fork lock.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   ladies Raleigh bicycle posted by Grant on 9/15/2000 at 5:07:28 PM
You must not have a "Sport" model. I think you have what is known
as a roadster or a DL1 model. These are a good deal rarer. Have you
visited Sheldon Brown's site yet? He has all the information and pictures
of different models.

MISC:   Norman Bike posted by: Jim on 9/11/2000 at 4:15:37 PM
Hi: I have a Norman Bike S/N T10535T made in Ashford, England. How can I find out if this bike has any value etc.

   RE:MISC:   Norman Bike posted by ChristopherRobin@starmail.com on 9/11/2000 at 5:01:58 PM
Please describe this in detail. What size wheels, color, cable brake or rod, gents or ladies frame,hub gear(Sturmey-Archer?) or derailur gears(Campy, Simplex or Huret or what?) How are the decals?

MISC:   Norman Bike posted by: Jim on 9/11/2000 at 4:15:37 PM
Hi: I have a Norman Bike S/N T10535T made in Ashford, England. How can I find out if this bike has any value etc.

AGE / VALUE:   'DAWES" BIKE?? posted by: STEVEN on 9/11/2000 at 1:40:00 PM

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   'DAWES posted by Tom Faust on 9/11/2000 at 6:00:38 PM
Dawes is a very old English manufacturer. Their website is dawescycle.com.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules? posted by: ron kapics on 9/11/2000 at 7:19:56 AM
Can anyone give me some info on a Hercles pump motion seat (model)? bike. thanks