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Archived: English Roadsters

AGE / VALUE:   age of found bike? posted by: valerie on 12/26/2002 at 4:53:21 PM
I found a RUDGE, serial number 87240OL (that is letter "OL")
Any idea how old it is?

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   age of found bike? posted by Brian on 12/26/2002 at 6:17:04 PM
Did you acquire a complete bike? Most of us identify the age of these bicycles by the date(s) stamped on the Sturmey Archer hub, and/or the GH-6 Dynamo. I also have a Rudge with the OL + 4 numbers. Does your bike say Rudge or Rudge-Whitworth on the chainguard? If you can post a url with a decent picture of your Rudge, I'm sure you'll get lots of help to your questions.

WANTED:   Upgrading from War Grade tyres posted by: Luke in Seattle on 12/26/2002 at 3:53:04 PM
Need advice! I need to re-tire my 1942 BSA paratrooper. Don't want to ruin the original War Grade tyres.

Luke in Seattle

   RE:WANTED:   Upgrading from War Grade tyres posted by Warren on 12/26/2002 at 5:43:46 PM
What do you want advice on? Tire selection? What size are the originals?

   RE:RE:WANTED:Upgrading from War Grade tyres posted by humberchristopher28@hotmail.com on 12/26/2002 at 7:23:04 PM
Since I had one of these I'll say 26 X 1 3/8 size wheels.
I have a newspaper clipping of a fellow named Krikorian who had ridden his around the world. He was photographed with a B.S.A. board member and they wrote an article telling how many miles he had done. He had converted it into a hybrid gear system and was saying how nice it was to ride.
I hope to get ahold of another one of these and do a conversion to it.
It's a lightweight full size, 26 inch wheel, folding model. The frame configuration is unique and makes for an easy and unique riding bike. I got mine for $75.00 and sold it for $400.00 but now these fetch up to 700.00 and well, I wish I had kept the thing. Now, I 'be wanting' another one. But cheap o me here refuses to pay what these are going for so it and no bargain is jumping up out of the water into my hands so It'll have to wait. This gnaws at me, I want one.
I have seen where you can find original grips and there is a whole host of up grade- hop up possibilities. I can always "borrow" parts and componets off of another bike. Plus being able to fold the thing in half and stick it in the trunk of the car and then ride all around town and avoid a parking hassle in town is a joy.
War grade means the tire was worth having because it was thicker rubber and many War grade tires are still in use on many bikes. Come to think of it, with all the bikes I have seen and some of which I have had the chance to get my grubby little hands on and buy and ride and enjoy. I wonder why I have not seen more folding paratrooper bikes. I could have been collecting these and hoarding B.S.A. parts if they had been more plentiful. Mine was always lent out for display at shops but the next one will get ridden a lot.
I have loaned out posters, whole bikes, gone to be in parades and done talks at museaums.
You can upgrade rims, wheels, hubs, go to a cotterless/alloy crank set up.

   my 2 cents posted by sam on 12/26/2002 at 10:44:25 PM
I'd keep the tyres and rims together,replacing both for simple riding.What I'd do is get a set of those rims we toss because there all rusty(late model chrome)and sand blast them clean.Then paint them to match the originals in army green.40 hold free wheel hubs are easy to find,this would keep it "almost" original when you take it for a spinn---sam

   RE:WANTED:   Upgrading from War Grade tyres posted by Luke in Seattle on 12/27/2002 at 3:05:36 AM
Thanks for the replies! I've kicked around several ideas since the bike arrived a few weeks ago.

#1. The guy who sold it me finally sends the name of the original owner. It turns out to be Monty's or Mountbatten's former ride. I hang the bike on the wall, regard the information as 'provenance' and the sorry paint job as 'patina.' My grandchildren discover the bike among my effects and auction it at Sotheby's. They spend a fraction of their take on a proper headstone for Grampa.

#2. The guy who sold it to me drinks up the money and I never hear from him again.

#3. I send the ruined saddle to Tony Colgrave for restoration, discover a good replacement 26 x 1 3/8 EA tyre, rebuild the wheels and bearings, tolerate the paint and ride the dang thing.

I'm leaning toward #3, with the possible addition of "sandblast, prime and paint it the original flat green."


   RE:WANTED:   Upgrading from War Grade tyres posted by Ray on 12/27/2002 at 2:49:22 PM
I picked up a BSA Paratrooper this year and have not had the time to touch it yet. I do know that it will need new leather on the saddle so I am interested in this fellow Tony Colgrave. Can someone tell me about him and his ability to restore the saddle. The rest of the bike is complete and in good condition. There is a hand painted letter A on the headtube and I am not sure why. Also the original owner removed the rivets that allows the frame to swing once the wing nuts are loosened. Does anyone have a photo of what these rivets look like so I can attempt a restoration. other than that it is all there. I am really anxious to get it on the road.

   RE:RE:WANTED:   Upgrading from War Grade tyres posted by Luke in Seattle on 12/28/2002 at 2:30:26 AM
I first read of Tony Colgrave on a Military vehicles collecotr's site:


A Google search revealed that Mr. Colgrave used to be a saddle maker (saddler?) for Brooks.

I spoke to him on the phone recently. Nice guy. Figured about 55 pounds for the new saddle, another 5 for installation. I plan to send the old one along to make sure the correct #40 with the big BSA badge is used.

You can speak to him on the phone too - 44-179-725-3177.

   RE:RE:WANTED:   Upgrading from War Grade tyres posted by Luke in Seattle on 12/28/2002 at 5:50:27 AM
The handpainted 'A' is probably a unit marking. 'A' division, troop or something...

I've got two closeup photos of the Wingnut mechanisms on my bike - they show the rivet pretty well. Send me a note (luke@seanet.com) and I'll scan them in and email them to you.


AGE / VALUE:   merry christmas posted by: paul v on 12/25/2002 at 12:34:26 AM
like P.C kohler,thanks everybody for an entertaining chat over the last year,hope it continues next year when i start my next project.Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year from all cyclists downunder Paul Viner

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   merry christmas posted by William on 12/25/2002 at 9:11:52 AM
Hi guys,Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all of you.May GOD's blessings be upon us all.See you guys next year and I'll be looking forward to more interesting and informative discussions.SEE YA and happy riding!!!

With best regards,
William Soon,Malaysia.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   merry christmas posted by Chris on 12/28/2002 at 8:58:34 PM
God's blessing (for me) being the god of old bikes,or whomever or whatever lady luck decides to arrange in the grande scheme of things so I get there first to find it and bring it home. I hope to see lady luck appear and smile upon me like she has done in years past.However I know what you are saying.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Happy Christmas! posted by: P.C. Kohler on 12/24/2002 at 11:14:13 PM
My Rudges, Raleighs and I wish all of you a very Happy Christmas! This is the best group on the web and it's been grand fun talking English Roadsters with this quirky and classy lot.

P.C. Kohler

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Last of the ghosts in the machine posted by: Edward inVancouver on 12/24/2002 at 4:15:10 AM
This afternoon, I finally got a few hours to "mess around" in the garage, and chased the last ghost out of my Superbe. Let me explain, a ghost for me is a small irritating problem that seems to have no cause or cure. When I first got the bike over two years ago I knew I was in for trouble, the wheels bent, AG missing the axle key, and cheap paint everywhere. Huh, obvious problems, and easily corrected. Problem was I couldn't ride the thing out of the store because the chain kept breaking apart. I'd turn the crank a few revolutions, then BLAM, the chain would snap. The clerk who sold me the bike avoided all eye contact, and occupied himself with changing the cash register tape. At first I thought the trouble was the master link, but it held together well. After alot of frustration and detective work, I discovered that who ever painted the bike (in Candian Tire's finest silver spraypaint!) put the chainguard back on with different screws, and one screw stuck out about a 1/4'' longer, just a hair away from the chain, then, when the master link hit it, it snapped. Ever since then I've been plagued with ghosts, and it's taken me this long to clear them up. Like the time when I finally re-assembled the re-painted bike. My finest hour? I couldn't ride the thing no-hands, it leaned over to the right like a drunk. I did all the string measurements, but the frame was true, took me a month to figure out the fork wasn't though... Or why the crank didn't "feel" right. Swallowing my pride I took it to an 80 yr old bike guru, who smiled at my problem, fished out a cheap kid's plastic 45 degree triangle and calmy told me that the chainwheel was straight, but the crank arm wasn't. Now why didn't I check that before I got the thing chromed?
My last ghost was a small one: When shifting into bottom gear, the FG whould chatter, then settle down. I studied all the stuff in Mr. Hadland's site, but no such problem was listed. I must have taken the hub apart three times over the last two years, but still no solution. Then last night I visited Sheldon's "care and feeding" site again, and it hit me like cheap aftershave on hastily shaven face, I had the axle nuts reversed. The axle nut with the little window goes on the left side, adjustment is made by looking at the indicator pin on the left side. The right nut doesn't have the little window and is smoother, enabling the indicator chain to slide freely. That's what was causing the chatter. Maybe I should just stick to riding bikes....

   Re:  ghosts in the machine posted by Warren on 12/24/2002 at 5:10:45 AM
Edward...you're becoming one with the bike. Kind of a "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance" experience. For anyone on the list who hasn't read Pirsig's novel, do yourself a favour and do so. It has little to do with motorcycles and less to do with bicycles but it is very rewarding.

Now...is a Raleigh Superbe "quality"?

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Last of the ghosts in the machine posted by Ray on 12/24/2002 at 3:47:53 PM
I have to say that I enjoyed reading your posting. Very well written. Not sure if you know that you have a gift for writing but that aside your story is one that every bicycle collector has come across now and then. You acquire a bike thinking that it only needs cosmetic work or some new or replacement parts and that is it. Quite often you run into those "ghosts" and they can stump the best of us. I had a friend who was riding his classic Alpine bicycle who just had it restored ground up with a fresh paint job and all. He told me that he had it to several experts explaining that there was a ringing sound when he was riding at high speeds but it came and went and was not consistant. He could not reproduce it in a bike stand and it was driving him nuts. On one of our Sunday rides he rode up next to me and said, do you hear that? I could hear the ringing then as quick as it came it dissappeared. We rode a few miles longer and it returned. I immediatly saw what was the problem. He had his rear brake cable routed with clips on the top of the top tube. When the wind caught it right it vibrated like a guitar string. I told him to put his hand over it and it stopped. He could not believe it because he could not locate the sound when on the bike. He has added one more cable clamp in the middle and the ghost was now gone. I am currently looking for a ghost that is plaguing my first year Trek 630. It shifts into high gear just fine but when I go to shift into lower gears (climbing the cluster)it over shoots and jumps around like a jackrabbit with the DTs. Because the bike belonged to someone else I do not know what they may have changed or not. I suspect the chain because the drive train is the Campy Grand Sport original. Are there any Ghostbusters out there who have had a similar problem. Happy Holidays

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Last of the ghosts in the machine posted by Fred on 12/26/2002 at 4:49:56 PM
What you experienced was a phenomenon called the "Von Kaarman Vortices". This phenomenom can not only excite a cable to resonate but caused the failure and collapse of the Tacoma Narrows bridge in the late 1930's. All it takes is a stiff breeze in the right direction. Happy new year to all.

   RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Last of the ghosts in the machine posted by Chris on 12/28/2002 at 9:03:54 PM
A bent or warped chainring where the pedal cranks attach to will cause the chain to do funny things. Replace it.
Find a axle key, and tinker a bit. No problem.You just gotta know how the ghost works and know the tricks and then it won't be so spooky.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Last of the ghosts in the machine posted by Chris on 12/31/2002 at 12:34:11 AM
I can just imagine the guys from the movie blasting the bike to bits and leaving saying "We'll send you our bill."
I liked the Cadillac ambulance from the movie and the cartoon series rocked!

WANTED:   S-A FW indicator chain posted by: Eric Amlie on 12/23/2002 at 7:04:08 PM
I recently bought a Sturmey-Archer FW four speed hub. Unfortunately the indicator chain wasn't included with the hub. Does this take a different indicator than the 3 speed AW? Does anyone know where I can get one? I can't seem to find any info about them on this site. Thanks in advance.

   RE:WANTED:   S-A FW indicator chain posted by Jeff R on 12/23/2002 at 8:20:41 PM
The AW indicator chain is different than the FW, FM, and FC indicator chain which is a two piece rod that threads togeather through each side of the hub. From time to time they come up on ebay. They are hard to find. It is also different than the two piece SW indicator chain.

   RE:WANTED:   S-A FW indicator chain posted by humberchristopher28@hotmail.com on 12/24/2002 at 12:37:28 AM
Eric, Try P.M Read of Phoenix Hub Gear Repairs
19 Red Bridge
Stantonbury, Milton Keynes, Buckinghamshire Mk 14
+44(0)1908227010 (phone and fax)

If you strike out with him, (and you shouldn't)
try St. John's Street Cycles.com

Go to Hadland.net and poke abut until you see the cycle hub section. this information is from Tony Hadlands website. There are others out there that can supply this part also. Hadland has the hub info as he wrote the book and the follow up info to.

As you were told, it is a special two piece indicator chain. The one piece A.W. three speed will not fit.
Read everything Tony Hadland has on the F.W. four speed. Have fun, good luck, enjoy and e- mail or post here with how you do.

   RE:WANTED:   S-A FW indicator chain posted by Ian on 12/24/2002 at 8:16:30 AM
Eric, I have several different types of new S.A. indicator chains in a box including two piece ones and do not want a lot for them but I am not sure which one fits your four speed. I would need to look at pictures with dimensions to be sure and send you the correct one so if somebody could point us in the direction of a web site you could confirm what you need and I could confirm that I have it. Although I am in New Zealand a small item like this could go letter rate so the postage should only be two or three dollars. Let me know if you don't have any luck locally and want to pursue it urther. Regards, Ian.

   RE:RE:WANTED:   S-A FW indicator chain posted by Jeff R on 12/24/2002 at 2:48:42 PM
Ian, about a year and a half ago I purchased several FW 4-speed indicator rods from you. The side with the chain is about 3/16" diameter and drops down to about an 1/8" diameter and has a female thread. The other side has a 3/16" diameter which drops down to a 1/8" diameter and has a male thread. The two screw together. The ones you sold me were perfect. They are in use today. I hope this information helps.

   RE: S-A FW indicator chain posted by Eric Amlie on 12/24/2002 at 10:54:35 PM
Thanks for the help everyone! I found a link to Peter Paine of England on one of the websites (Tony Hadland's?) and Peter has agreed to sell me the proper indicator. The price is not cheap ($19.00 with shipping from G.B. to U.S.) but I guess these things aren't getting any easier to find so I decided to just go for it. Thanks again for the help everyone, and Merry Christmas to all of you.

WANTED:   Wanted: Brooks B66 posted by: P.C. Kohler on 12/23/2002 at 3:45:20 PM
Looking for an early '50s era Brooks gents B66 with the following: chrome undercarriage and long "keyhole" style perforations (not the later round holes).

P.C. Kohler

   RE:WANTED:   Wanted: Brooks B66 posted by David Poston on 12/23/2002 at 7:38:13 PM

You really are a period-fanatic, aren't you? I would have just ordered a brand-new one. Keyhole perforations? Aren't we getting a little carried away here?


   RE:RE:WANTED:   Wanted: Brooks B66 posted by P.C. Kohler on 12/23/2002 at 7:51:04 PM
David... if you wear period clothes, then don't you want the right indentations in the seat of those 1911 cycling plusfours? Keyhole perforations are simply a must on your Brooks saddle. You gotta have 'em. Ask anyone on this list. Oh, and the saddle needs that cool little metal loop handle thingy in the back too. Very important.

P.C. Kohler

   RE:RE:RE:WANTED:   Wanted: Brooks B66 posted by Chris on 12/24/2002 at 12:39:37 AM
If you are ever going to pick up the bike, then that cool metal loop is something you want to be part of the saddles spring undercariage frame.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules Bike posted by: Tom on 12/23/2002 at 3:31:14 AM
I saw pictures of a bike this week. It is a Hercules bike like a Raleigh Sports, sky blue. It has 26 x 1 1/4" rims, maybe stainless. The rear hub is a flip flop with a fixed on one side, freewheel on the other. 3 pin crank not Williams. The fork has a 6" chrome tip with a good curve at the bottom. Has Bluemell style mudguards maybe alloy not celluloid, double braces mounted to frame and fork. Front wheel has wingnuts. Has Apex pump. The seat is a Dunlop. Alloy stem with North Roads style bars. The brakes are clamped on the fork and rear stays. They are cable operated but they have no lever action at the brakes, a cable runs to each brake pad. The bike is not light like road bikes but it looks like a lightweight bike. The bike is very nice. Kept in a dry basement for many years.
Do the Dunlop rims have stainless stamped into them? Does anyone have any old Hercules books with this style of bike in it? What year would this bike be, 50's or 60's? What would the value be? The bike may have been updated with different bars for comfort. Any ideas what this bike is.Anyone have any Hercules books with this type of bike.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules Bike posted by Warren on 12/23/2002 at 4:51:52 AM
Tom...go to http://www.classicrendezvous.com/British/Hercules.htm and you will see similar bikes. I think it is likely prewar. I've seen those funky brakes but I know little about them. This is a typical club bike. The Dunlop rims will say Stainless if they are and Special Lightweight if they are chromed steel. I have a '52 Hercules but it has a 3 speed cog and Hercules derailleur but it came with an optional flip flop hub and EA1 rims as well. Bluemel made a few great alloy fender sets...Airweight is one of them...could be an add on. My Herc has OEM mudguards. Although British club bikes don't make big prices as a rule, this one sounds interesting and in good condition. It's tough to give a value...you need the right buyer for this one.

Do the frame lugs have little oval cut outs? If you look close, the lugs may be pinned for alignment before brazing. If you get a serial number, we can compare it to my '52.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules Bike posted by Tom on 12/23/2002 at 7:10:02 AM
Warren Here is a picture of the bike. http://ca.photos.yahoo.com/bc/oldy57bikes/vwp?.dir=/My+Photos&.dnm=Hercules+Club+Bike.jpg&.src=ph&.view=t&.hires=t

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules Bike posted by Ian on 12/23/2002 at 8:53:52 AM
Tom, For some reason I could not access the pictures but the brakes you describe sound like Resilion brand. Do the cables go in to a junction box with two cables coming out to each side shoe? If these brakes are original I would say that it is pre-war as they were not made after WW2. My 1937 Maclean Featherweight has these on it. There is a brief description and picture of the brakes in the Cycles de Oro section on British component manufcturers at Classic Rendezvous http://www.classicrendezvous.com/British/Resilion_main.htm Hope this helps. Merry Christmas, Ian in New Zealand.

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules Bike posted by Warren on 12/23/2002 at 1:54:04 PM
I couldn't get to that pic either Tom. The brakes I was thinking of attached to the fork and frame similar to rod brakes stirrups. The cables were thick and proprietary like the resilions and metal "couplers" between the sections. I thinke there was a junction as Ian describes. They could be a type of Resillion although the ones I saw were not like the Cantis shown on the CR site.

Anyway, maybe your Yahoo folder has to be made accessible to others

   RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules Bike posted by Tom on 12/23/2002 at 4:53:13 PM
Here is another link. Maybe this will work. http://ca.photos.yahoo.com/bc/oldy57bikes/lst?.dir=/My+Photos&.view=t The bike looks post war. It is maybe 1950's or 1960's. It is an interesting bike.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules Bike posted by humberchristopher28@hotmail.com on 12/23/2002 at 6:40:36 PM
Im looking for a Hercules rod brake machine with those narrow Westwood rims in 26 X 1 3/8.
I have taking a liking to original Hercules.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules Bike posted by Warren on 12/23/2002 at 9:10:48 PM
It's got a Williams crank that could be 40's to 50's...the Dunlop seat is a similar period. The brakes look like a knock off of the Resilion "Cantilette" brakes. They were the poorer cousins of the full cantilever models seen on the CR site. These brakes were available in the early 50's (page 12 Brown Bros. '52 catalogue). The alloy chainguard makes it look newer as well. Although hard to see, the rims look like an alloy as well. I'd take a guess that this is a mid 50's club bike that was modded to be a sit-up Sports bike. It's very cool. A full description of the components may help nail down the date. Put some drop bars and a Brooks Pro and you've have a great path racer.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules Bike posted by P.C. Kohler on 12/24/2002 at 2:20:19 AM
I have a 1950 Hercules catalogue which features some pretty amazing Club machines. I admit it: I associate Hercules with being a mid to low range brand. Well I am WRONG. Dead wrong. These Club bikes are top of the line. Like the Kestrel Super Club (which cost £28. 1 s. 9 d.!!!). If folks are interested, I can scan and post these on Roll Britannia. None, however, have that unique brake arrangement.

P.C. Kohler

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules Bike posted by Howard on 12/24/2002 at 3:16:59 AM
I have a 49 or 50 hercules kestrel super club. It is a 3 speed,with good original paint. I am looking for a proper set of drop bars and alloy fender stays.Any one have anything or can you recommend a similar replcement . I am not big into british bikes but I always enjoy the enthusiastic discussions on this forum and I have learned a lot about these bikes here. Thanks everyone.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:Hercules Bike posted by humberchristopher28@hotmail.com on 12/26/2002 at 7:25:15 PM
I have the color catalog sheet for that bike! e- mail for a copy.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   I've Meself a Club Bike posted by: P.C. Kohler on 12/23/2002 at 3:34:25 AM
She’s mine, all mine.

After more than few disappointments and missed opportunities, I finally have what I consider to be the ultimate in British cycles: a “club bike”! That 1951, model 29 Raleigh Lenton “Tourist” on eBay has a new home: mine! OK, so she cost me some £230 plus shipping from the UK and needs repainting in glorious “polychromatic olive green”, but she’s MINE! All of her: 23-inch frame, Reynolds 531 tubing, alloy seat post, chainguard and “comfort flat” handlebars, Dunlop light alloy 26 x 1/4" rims, Sturmey Archer alloy shell FM four-speed hub and white celluloid mudguards and original pump. Like a Comet 1 on two wheels. British genius. From what I can determine, this touring version of the Lenton was only in production c. 1950-52. The only thing she needs is a GH6 dynohub and the original chrome-plated undercarriage Brooks B66 saddle. Hopefully she’ll be off to Cycles of Yesteryear for a complete repaint and relining before heading across the Atlantic.

P.C. Kohler, dead broke but dead chuffed.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   I've Meself a Club Bike posted by Warren on 12/23/2002 at 4:58:56 AM
I'm "polychromatic olive green" with envy. Can't find those easily.

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   I've Meself a Club Bike posted by David Poston on 12/23/2002 at 6:47:32 AM

I have a two-part question for you:

1) Where do you find room to store all these bikes in your apartment? (I need to know how you do it, because I'm moving out of my parent's roomy house in February--getting married, that is--and need to store five roadsters somehow).

2) How do you ever get your wife to allow "another one!" into the house?

David, who is wondering whether he's going to have Raleighs and Rudges hanging off his living room ceiling.

   RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   I've Meself a Club Bike posted by P.C. Kohler on 12/23/2002 at 1:55:03 PM
Gee, David... I'm still over the moon over my Lenton-- did I mention she has "GB Sport hiduminium brakes"?-- and you have to bring up practical issues like storage space AND feminine sensibilities!

So, practicing for when my wife returns from England... "Well, we have a new cycle room in the apartment house so now there are only four bicycles in the bedroom" or "When are you going back home to England...?" or... "This Lenton is IT... end of collection". Take your pick. Me, I'm just going to hop on my Polychromatic Olive Green machine and Ride Awheel on Sheffield hiduminium.

P.C. Kohler

   RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   I've Meself a Club Bike posted by Jeff R on 12/23/2002 at 2:57:22 PM
I have a 48 Lenton/Clubman same color, fenders ect. but mine has alloy drop bars. I don't like the low bars and would love to find a set of comfort bars. Can anybody help me out? I have looked on ebay with no luck.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   I've Meself a Club Bike posted by Edward in Vancouver on 12/23/2002 at 4:08:08 PM
I'll do you a big favour, P.C., and take a few bikes off your hands, It's the least I can do for you...
However if you need a 32 spk Dynohub circa 1956, give me a shout, I just found one wrapped up in a ziplock bag behind a milkcrate of brake levers in the sport consignment store where I hang out, and get this, there was even a can of S.A. oil in the bag as well!

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   I've Meself a Club Bike posted by P.C. Kohler on 12/23/2002 at 4:48:46 PM
Thanks Edward... I might take you up on the offer when the missus comes back! But I do have a '52 GH6, I reckon that's close enough for a '51 machine to 'work'. Now... why didn't SA make an alloy shell GH6 for sexy bikes like the Lentons? It's like putting army combat boots on a marathon runner. BSA had alloy shell "Hublites".

P.C. Kohler

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   I've Meself a Club Bike posted by Chris on 12/23/2002 at 5:48:47 PM
B.S.A. had a lawsuit skirmish over the dynohubs. I don't remember the outcome but it's in the Tony Hadland book
The Sturmey- Archer story. Perhaps this is why there was no alloy shelled Sturmey- Archer dyno?
The B.S.A. Hublight was finicky, at least thats what I have heard perhaps thats not exactly true. Anyways, where would you would find a replacement armeture?
I have never seen one offered. Now the Sturmey dynohub you can find replacement armetures and they even offer these here on oldroads.com.

AGE / VALUE:   Pedal tHreading posted by: David Poston on 12/22/2002 at 9:16:17 PM
Forgive my sense of humour...

Does anyone know if any of these pedals will fit my Raleigh?




   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Pedal tHreading posted by Mark R./Mucus on 12/22/2002 at 11:35:39 PM
No, these are probably 1/2" thread. Do you need a pair of Raleigh pedals? I have a pair for $15 plus shipping.
Lemme know.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Pedal tHreading posted by David Poston on 12/23/2002 at 6:38:37 AM

1) Do they have reflectors? (no reflectors for me)
2) Are they the larger gents size?

I already have several sets of older pedals (two NOS pairs) which are a ladies size, alas.


   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Pedal threading posted by humberchristopher28@hotmail.com on 12/23/2002 at 6:28:14 PM
Item #2150890046 are pedals for American bikes, they won't fit.
Item #2150889762 are Phillips pedals and they belong on a Phillips bike. After these are cleaned up.
Phillips and Raleigh had diffrent threadings and I think that applies to pedals as well.

It should not be difficult to find a nice set of Raleigh Pedals.
The E- bay seller in Nicossea, Andreau or that other guy, If you look a bit on e- bay you should be able to find something N.O.S.

AGE / VALUE:   Pedal treading posted by: David Poston on 12/22/2002 at 8:59:21 PM
Forgive me for my double post for you Rollbritannia forumites...

I have a pair of NOS Union pedals with the large diamond pyramid tread. I'm wondering when the large diamond tread was introduced? 1970's? Is this a modern invention, or did they have this type of treading back in earlier days?


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Pedal treading posted by David Poston on 12/22/2002 at 9:07:46 PM
The treads look like this:


   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Pedal treading posted by David Poston on 12/22/2002 at 9:29:03 PM
Forgot to say that these pedals with the large diamond tread have no reflectors, which makes them hard to place since they are probably of 1970's vintage.


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Pedal treading posted by Warren on 12/23/2002 at 12:22:37 AM
I think they are early 70's vintage. I have two other models of Union pedals...square and oval (reflectors) with a pebbled finish on the rubbers...all of them have quality bearings. I think I've seen the pyramid pattern on older bikes but I can't find an example of them just now. I'd have no problems using them as replacements on earlier roadsters...until I found originals at least.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Pedal treading posted by Warren on 12/24/2002 at 5:17:03 AM
David...I just found a few nice examples of this same tread dating back to 1950 including Phillips. Fear not using these pedals.

AGE / VALUE:   Santa rode a flying Raleigh! posted by: humberchristopher28@hotmail.com on 12/22/2002 at 7:50:16 PM
I was buying up a lot of things and already had bought the last Tourist they had on hand. Then they had a strange request one November. "We want one of your Raleigh's. The one with the enclosed chainguard and the leather Brooks B-90/3 seat.
Bring it over and leave it with us for awhile" I said "Ok, but why?" It was a surprise. So I draged it back over there!

Later I see that a Santa manequin was astride the bicycle that was hung in the air in front of the window. Santa was astride a flying Raleigh with a big bag of cycle parts. A motor was making the wheels turn and the dynohub lit up the lights. His black leather boots were attached to the pedals and his legs moved up and down. Old St Nick got some serious non- stop exercise for over a month! It was an animated(moving display) A sign telling about gift cards and lay- away. The bike was mint and it made for one neat window display. They were very busy and even though I was there to cart away old inventory, I ended up on the shop floor selling new bikes and ringing up things! They put me to work! "Oh, you can come get that stuff anytime, we need you today!" Besides, I was already through every nook and cranny in the place and therefore I knew what was where. The window display was a hit! I did an acceptable job too.

Have a happy and safe Holiday season. I hope you find something neat, interesting and fun in the year ahead.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Brit Bike weekend and etc. posted by: Michael McGettigan on 12/22/2002 at 5:44:56 PM
Greetings -- just a note for those who've missed earlier announcements... the Great British Bike Weekend returns for a 6th annual gathering: 3 days for Three Speeds... from clattering DL-1 Roadsters to pristine restored Choppers, the GBBW has become an interesting affair... with rides, Sturmey hub workshops, a picnic, swap meet and the carefully supervised Bike and Pub Crawl. Skedded for April 4, 5 & 6th, 2003! This year's event will be take a moment to mark the passing of Nottingham's Raleigh factory-- the last bikes are being assembled this month, and next year will be the first in more than a century that new bikes didn't roll forth under the Nottingham sky. Just as jarringly, we recently received our first 2002 Sturmey Hub -- no engraved date, alloy shell, and only a little silkscreened logo--"Sunrace Sturmey Archer" -- made in Taiwan. Well-made, from the look of it, still the product of British minds, but not Nottingham hands.

Despite all this, we plan to ride and enjoy these solid, simple bikes for all they're worth. What else can we do?

McG/Trophy Bikes Phila

PS for a bit more GBBW info, check www.trophybikes.com from time to time.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Brit Bike weekend and etc. posted by Albert on 12/22/2002 at 8:06:11 PM
And just what is a "carefully supervised Bike and Pub Crawl"? Your description posted on this site would make good reading!

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Brit Bike weekend and etc. posted by dafydd on 12/22/2002 at 8:48:53 PM
Oh boy, here we go again... I'll be there all the same on some sort of contraption. Maybe the mock club bike, soon to have campy track cranks!

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Brit Bike weekend and etc. posted by paul on 12/23/2002 at 12:06:53 AM
I note one of our fellow posters is looking for a definition of "carefully supervised". My on line Merriam's says "meticulously overseen", by that we may very well mean that we enthusiasts will view with awe the wonderful machines and bicyclists at this function and we will NOT find the fellow's ramblings (like last year) from now until April 2003 the LEAST BIT INTERESTING!!! paul

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Brit Bike weekend and etc. posted by Tony D. on 12/24/2002 at 4:19:16 PM
Regardless of supervision, if you are over 21 (or 18 in PA)enjoy the "crawl" like an adult, and don't over do it. Have a drink if you want, enjoy a Coke if you can't handle your Guiness. Personally, I'm gonna have a Guiness.
Drunkards, or minors should avoid it at all costs!

   RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Brit Bike weekend and etc. posted by Dewane on 12/26/2002 at 10:07:16 PM

   RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Brit Bike weekend and etc. posted by Tony D. on 12/27/2002 at 5:13:35 PM
On My God! Those men probably went off after that drink, and killed people!!!! AAAAARRRRRGGGGGG!!!!!How horrible, how dastardly, how absolutely un-politcally correct!! The feinds!

   RE:Bikes, Pubs, the universe and everything posted by Michael McGettigan on 12/29/2002 at 3:11:30 AM
SETTING THE RECORD STRAIGHT --Mr. Meinster says a number of organizations have signed onto his campaign againt the Great British Bike Weekend. Well, sort of.
I've spoken to the Bike Coalition, which has taken NO official position on Mr. Meinsters haranguing calls. Ditto for MADD, and the American Auto Association, which said, "he sounds like a nut." The Philadelphia Police Department has no record of his calls, and Mr. Meinster is unable to provide me with the single name of anyone he spoke to.

His supervisor at Edison High School, who was not happy to hear that Mr. Meinster was making his calls on school property and on the taxpayers' time, said he was a "nice enough guy"... not dangerous... and "a competent teacher-- not one of our best--but competent..."

That said, I realize that everyone needs a hobby and Mr. Meinster's appears to be telling other people how safe cycling is done... a google search on his name shows him occasionally spouting off about how one or another cycling activity is too dangerous in his untrained, unexpert opinion--which he is entitled to.

But enough... let's get back the 7th (!) Great British Bike Weekend in Philadelphia (4/6-8, 2003).. which may be the biggest yet.

I cordially invite our little high school teacher to join us for the GBBW's workshops on Brit Bike hubs, rides and rallies, and a toast to the sad end of more than a century of bike production in Nottingham.

I'm sure he will enjoy three days for 3 speeds, in the company of intelligent adults, who ride and partake within their limits.

And I'm sure he will add his voice and authority, should anyone appear to be acting in an irresponsible fashion. I'll gladly toss the offender in a cab, and secure his bike to be retrieved the next day.

A good night to all , and thanks for posting to this great list.

Thanks too, to VVVintage for hosting it.

Michael McGettigan/trophy bikes phila.... www.trophybikes.com

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   English Sports questions posted by: Brian on 12/22/2002 at 2:12:01 PM
On the right-inside, about four inches down from the fork crown (of my Rudge Sport fork) there is a small welded-on nub of metal (like a l'il bump kinda)..why did Raleigh put that there?

Second question: I've been coming along with the DBU/GH6 wiring harness, but was wondering just how that seatpost ground works? Do I run a small slice off the appropriate lead, and connect the other stripped end to the seatpost binder bolt? Is there a neat/correct way to do this?

My final question will probably get a chuckle out of the other collecter's/restorer's of these bicycles, but here goes - what are the chances of acquiring a set of Raleigh pattern 26" stainless-steel rims in the classic 32/40 drilling? Is there anything close available to these?

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   English Sports questions posted by P.C. Kohler on 12/22/2002 at 4:13:00 PM
That's a lamp bracket peg. Back in the days when a "Sports" was considered just that: a sporty, lithe little mount. I think this was phased out by the late 50s. Indeed with some cosmetic changes, the Sports was originally sold as a wannabe club machine with dropped handlebars, white steel mudguards with wire fasteners, rat-trap pedals, no chainguard etc. That's a project down the road for me: take a beater sports, early '50s vintage, and refit her as a club machine.

Stainless steel rims: I got some old ones from Cycles of Yesterday (UK). Problem is the cost of shipping: ridiculous! £60! So I picked them up in England last week and brought them home. There are no new substitutes; none of the Indian manufacturers seem to work with stainless or alloys alas.

P.C. Kohler

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   English Sports questions posted by P.C. Kohler on 12/22/2002 at 4:14:06 PM
make that Cycles of YESTERYEAR...

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   English Sports questions posted by Brian on 12/22/2002 at 6:02:46 PM
I don't have a trip to England planned in the near future, but I'm buying if someone is selling. Out of all my Raleigh rims, only one is acceptable. Rechroming my old rims is like the shipping from England you mentioned-(and no guarantee that the rechrome will be good!)astronomically expensive.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   English Sports questions posted by Edward in Vancouver on 12/22/2002 at 10:35:02 PM
Brian, I'll send you a ground, but you'll have to e-mail me your mailing adress again, it got "purged" when I was cleaning up my mailing list files. Basiclly all it is is a little copper plate, about the size of a quarter, with a hole for the seatpost binder bolt to go through, and a little curled lip for the ground wire to crimp on. For a GH6, it's necesary for a ground if you use a tailight, because it saves one wire going to the headlamp switch. I've got both wires from the GH6 on my Sports going up the fork and then directly to the headlamp, but I don't have a taillamp, just an LED blinky. Actually this isn't a bad setup, as the headlamp burns brighter, and the LED gets more attention than a regular red bulb.
It's interesting about that little bump on the fork though, because I've got one on my Superbe as well.

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   English Sports questions posted by humberchristopher28@hotmail.com on 12/23/2002 at 5:54:43 PM
Lamp brackets are seen on e- bay, e- mail Hilary Stone who should be able to scare up one of these.
Chater Lea, made these in alloy but I would guess that for the Raleigh you would need to go with something Raleigh made. They really don't mix these, I don't think.
Raleigh wanted you to use their lamp brackets in conjunction with their bikes. Their pegs fit their brackets. Maybe I'm wrong with this one. Ask Hilary!

MISC:   Ealing Films cont'd posted by: P.C. Kohler on 12/22/2002 at 1:24:18 AM
Apologies for revisiting this subject, but the highlight, cycle interest-wise, of the continuing Ealing Studios retrospective on Turner Movie Classics, has to be "Decision Against Time" (1957), a test pilot drama (and a corker of one too) starring Jack Hawkins. A continuing theme is a group of seven or so young cyclists (even credited!) on a club run who happen on the airstrip to witness the unfolding drama aloft. All are riding the absolute pick of Raleigh's 1957 line: lads on dropped handlebar Lentons and ladies on Trent Tourists with those cool "all rounder" handlebars. Some great close-ups. Ah, all those celluloid mudguards and wonderful '50s riding "costumes" of the ladies...

P.C. Kohler