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Archived: English Roadsters

MISC:   London Cycle Shops posted by: P.C. Kohler on 7/15/2002 at 4:45:59 PM
I will be in London next month; does anyone have any recommendations for cycle shops there that still cater, in any fashion, to we English roadster types? I mean a place that has Sturmey Archer oil. Proofide, maybe the odd NOS stuff in dusty boxes? Most of the cycle shops I've visited in the UK are just the same as here and I feel I am from another planet.

P.C. Kohler

   RE:MISC:   London Cycle Shops posted by JohnM on 7/15/2002 at 5:44:03 PM
Don't know about London, but if you're going anywhere near York, seems like Cycle Heaven might be worth a visit (www.cycle-heaven.co.uk). I've never been there, but I bought some stuff by mail - they're a dealer for Gazelle and Dawes, among others.

   RE:MISC:   London Cycle Shops posted by Chris on 7/15/2002 at 7:11:24 PM
Go to the local dump, scrap yard, recycle stop, skips, trash day, 2 nd hand shops. Look for other cycle buffs in the area. The bike shops are gonna sell Cannondale, rock shock oil, new modern junk made in China.
Safe trip and I hope it is fruitful.

   RE:RE:MISC:   London Cycle Shops posted by Kevin C. on 7/16/2002 at 12:08:31 PM
Check with the Veteran Cycle Club (it has a website). They will probably know where the bicycle swap meets are held and where the collectors go to buy parts.

   RE:RE:RE:MISC:   London Cycle Shops posted by Chris on 7/16/2002 at 4:41:42 PM
Do that, pick their brains

   RE:MISC:   London Cycle Shops posted by Ed on 7/17/2002 at 7:35:16 PM
When I was last in London(1974).They held a large fiea market every weekend on Portabello(sp.)Rd. Near Bayswater Dr. lots of old bikes and parts as I recall.Sorry I can't help with shop locations.

FOR SALE:   Nice Triumph on eBay posted by: P.C. Kohler on 7/15/2002 at 3:38:39 AM
OK, so it's 'only' a Triumph... but take a look at lovely example of a low-end English three-speed on eBay. The transfers alone are worth a look!


P.C. Kohler

MISC:   What is it? posted by: Tim on 7/15/2002 at 3:00:32 AM
I've just been given a Raleigh Mountain Tour 15 speed. The frame is completely chromed and it has very large chromed mudguards. What is it? (Age, value etc). I've been collecting English 3 speeds for some time so it doesn't really fit the collection but it really is a cool looking bike, and is fun to ride.

I've also just bought a Rudge with no gears and a coaster brake. Is it English or American? I didn't think coaster brakes were used on English bikes.

Finally, my first real bike, back in England where I grew up was a Vindec. I cannot find any reference to this name other than as an early motorcycle manufacturer. Anyone any ideas? Thanks, Tim

   RE:MISC:   What is it? posted by Warren on 7/16/2002 at 12:43:10 AM
The mtn bike is eminently unforgettable and should be passed along to the thrift store quickly before you get tempted to ride it...the horror, the horror...

The english likely invented and pefected the coaster brake...Perry hubs come to mind.

   RE:RE:MISC:   What is it? posted by Warren on 7/16/2002 at 12:05:26 PM
Ooops...I mean forgetable...

AGE / VALUE:   Schram wins a lawsuit posted by: Chris on 7/14/2002 at 6:28:48 PM
Schram won the lawsuit apparently. I hear it will be impossible to get anything internal hub related except single speed kids hubs. This means cables, hubs, forget the Nexus! You won't find one soon. This is very, very bad news!

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Schram wins a lawsuit posted by rickey@knowles bicycle shop on 7/15/2002 at 11:54:23 PM
sram dosen't make NEXUS THERE SHOULDNOT

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Schram wins a lawsuit posted by rickey@knowles bicycle shop on 7/15/2002 at 11:54:35 PM
sram dosen't make NEXUS THERE SHOULDNOT

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Schram wins a lawsuit posted by xxxxxx on 7/15/2002 at 11:56:25 PM
be hard to get

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Schram wins a lawsuit posted by Chris on 7/16/2002 at 4:43:24 PM
I hear they are gonna affect the whole marketplace in a negative way. i hope not, we'll see.
Shimano makes the Nexus.

WANTED:   Raleigh Shifter Cable fo r' 71 Rod Brake Bike... posted by: Fred A on 7/14/2002 at 1:07:12 AM
Hi all........

I'm trying to find the shifter cable for a 3-speed Sturmey Archer to fit my Raleigh Rod Brake Bike from 1971. Wheels are 28". I'm in the early stages of refinishing/restoring the bike. As I lifted it today by the top bar, the cable was rusted and snapped. So much for all original parts! Any info is appreciated........

   RE:WANTED:   Raleigh Shifter Cable fo r' 71 Rod Brake Bike... posted by Chris on 7/14/2002 at 6:55:09 PM
Well, You might be able to find brass tubing to crimp over bare cable for the shifter part like Sturmey Archer did. But question is, will you be able to find cable in the right size in the first place?
Does brake cable go into 3 speed gear housing and through the Sturmey-Archer trigger metal collar thingie? No, I don't think so, it's larger. Where you find the exact size/number of threads in the steel braided cable I don't yet know.
The Sturmey triggers, all of them only accept one size of cable too. it is not adjustable or forgiving.

Can cables be made up when you can't find a length you want?

26 wheel bikes are not a problem as you can find it here at oldroads.com

But 28 inch Tourist cable? I don't see it listed. Other companies sold Universal cable in extra long cut to fit lengths but that is not offered here.

Friction shifters compatable with Sturmey-Archer hubs? Sheldon says Yes. He would know. That gets around a shifter cable shortage problem, but is it exact? I don't like getting away from the original trigger sold by Sturmey-Archer where it is evenly spaced. A clumsey or inaccurate shift can and will do hub damage like chipping of dogs or teeth. The Sturmey-Archer shifter goes click, click, click. No problem.
When friction shifters were mentioned I don't understand what exactly Sheldon meant anyways. What brand? Does the (probably Shimano) shifter just move back and forth or go click, click, click too? Both types are made. I have both types and by the way these are exactly what you won't be able to get. All this buying up of parts to sit on is trying too. My pal snapped up sprockets like no tomorrow and he does not have 14 tooth sprockets either. It's all very maddening and it has been like this for twenty years. Now it is supposed to get way, way worse.
I have Chopper shift cables and I cannot believe the prices the Chopper folks in England want for it.
Be careful with what I say here because admittedly I sometimes inadvertantly make a simple thing more difficult. Think over my thoughts and decide if I'm right on or off track. I do know that before the net I found it difficult to find 28 inch wheel 3 speed cable.
The other triggers like Hercules Synchro switch and G. Goannou( Miami) shifter cable was the same as Sturmey- Archer cable. just diffrent facia.

Does Shimano Cable interchange with Sturmey-Archer? This was discussed here a way, way back a spell. Albert mentioned this. I forget what he reported to the group here. I'll visit a place that makes cables and motrorcycle shops too.
Always more than one way to skin a cat.
You just need a cat skinner with proper tools, suppliers and experience.

   RE:RE:WANTED:   Raleigh Shifter Cable fo r' 71 Rod Brake Bike... posted by Chris on 7/14/2002 at 6:58:53 PM
Meant to say that Shimano cable does NOT interchange with Sturmey-Archer cable. Question is, does the Shimano shifter work with a Sturmey-Archer hub? and work right?
Don't yet know.

   RE:RE:RE:WANTED:   Raleigh Shifter Cable fo r' 71 Rod Brake Bike... posted by Edward inVancouver on 7/15/2002 at 12:26:18 AM
Chris almost got it. Use any old cable and housing you want. Then trot off to a shop that sells hobby railroad stuff, they'll have a box of different diameter brass tubes, and these are cheap. Select the tube that fits your cable most snugly. Cut off and crimp a piece (aprox 3/8") at the begining of the cable and thread it into the S.A. trigger. Try out the action, it works. Then do the same to the end of the cable, first sliding on the cable housing and the knurled nut before crimping on the brass tube. I've put such cables on two bikes, both with 4 speed hubs and I haven't had a problem yet, inspite of the extra stress the extra gear puts on the cable.
It was only after I made a tire boot out of a dollar bill and pine tree sap so I could get home one day a long time ago, that it occured to me that I could still ride a bike even if I didn't have the right parts. As the Swiss would say: Not macht erfinderisch, or: Neccesity is the Mother of invention.

   RE:RE:RE:WANTED:   Raleigh Shifter Cable fo r' 71 Rod Brake Bike... posted by Fred A on 7/15/2002 at 12:28:08 AM
Thanks, Chris, for all the energy & time put into your reply. I really appreciate it!

I guess that maybe it's time to hit some of the bikes shops and see if they can find an old, dust covered box with cables in them (yeah, like that will happen!!!)
I had already checked this web site and found that 26" was as good as it got. Never thought it would be this difficult to find something like this for a bike only 31 years young!
Thanks again for all of your insight. Let this be a warning to other owners with possibly the same upcoming problem!!!!!!


   RE:RE:RE:RE:WANTED:   Raleigh Shifter Cable fo r' 71 Rod Brake Bike... posted by Fred A on 7/15/2002 at 12:33:15 AM
Edward, you sound like you use to watch MacGuyver on TV! Thanks for this bit of info, and I'll give it a shot! Would be a shame to get the bike all done and only be able to ride it in one gear!
Always best to ask questions on Oldroads.......someone is always reading who has the answers.

Thanks again to you and Chris!

   RE:WANTED:   Raleigh Shifter Cable fo r' 71 Rod Brake Bike... posted by geo on 7/15/2002 at 1:19:33 AM
Hey folks, Similar thing happened to me. I bought a DL-1 beater for $50 that was missing some stuff. Trigger and shifter cable among them and it seems to me that I just grabbed them off a ladies Sports that I've been using for parts. Had plenty of length to work with. I've also bought a couple of off-brand SA shifter cables at local bike shops for around six bucks. Seems to me this is an easier fix than it appears to be. Unless I've just been fortunate or I'm missing something. Check local bike shops. If they've been around awhile they may have left overs. I've got one guy who loves to see me coming, I end up buying stuff he'd be throwing out. I believe these can be ordered too. Good luck. Geo

   RE:RE:WANTED:   Raleigh Shifter Cable fo r' 71 Rod Brake Bike... posted by Chris on 7/15/2002 at 7:15:51 PM
If you see "off brand" shifter cable at your local shop, buy it up. Soon they will act like it never existed at all and they won't have anything at all. Many shops just act like it's time this stuff came to an end and they deliberately don't carry anything we are looking for.

   RE:WANTED:   Raleigh Shifter Cable fo r' 71 Rod Brake Bike... posted by Cal on 7/17/2002 at 11:56:38 AM
They sell those cables right here on this site!

AGE / VALUE:   Seeking info on Hercules Cycle-Truck posted by: Kevin C. on 7/13/2002 at 12:03:34 PM
I just bought a British Hercules delivery bicycle at a bike show in Indiana and was wondering if anyone has any information on one. Like a Schwinn Cycle-Truck, it has a 26(?) inch wheel on the rear, 20 inch on the front, but instead of having a regular large delivery basket on the front it has a basket holder made of steel tubing. This bike is single speed, with rod brakes front and rear. The rear hub is stamped "THE VILLIERS," or something like that, and "MODEL DELUXE." It has heavy fenders and wire fender braces. The fenders stand a couple of inches away from the tires. There are two brackets for a front drop stand, which would lift the front wheel and loaded basket off the ground when making a delivery stop, but the drop stand itself is missing. I would love to know what the stand looked like so I could fabricate a replacement. Thank you in advance.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Seeking info on Hercules Cycle-Truck posted by ChristopherRobin2@starmail.com on 7/13/2002 at 5:48:23 PM
Contact Pashley in England for replacement spares.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Seeking info on Hercules Cycle-Truck posted by Ian on 7/14/2002 at 6:53:23 AM
Kevin, I will scan a photo of my 1930's Hercules grocery bike and send it to you. They were made the same for many years so it is likely yours will be the same. If neccessary I can measure the stand once I get the bike out of storage and into my new display area. As you have the small front wheel you have the grocery bike which would have had a woven cane basket inside the frame. The other version was a butchers bike which had 26" wheels front and back. The reason for the difference was that meat was supposedly heavier and therefore the rider could not carry so much of it and therefore the basket could be smaller and the bigger front wheel carried the load better. The butchers bike had a steel mesh basket. Villiers (who also made motorcyle motors) made many proprietary bits for bikes used by a variety of English manufacturers. Be warned that they ride dreadfully with a load in the basket and many of us in this country rode one as our first after school job and lost the job when we crashed the bike! The late John Pinkerton wrote a booklet on trade bicycles which is available through th Veteran Cycle Club in England. Hope this helps, Regards, Ian.

AGE / VALUE:   identify bike posted by: Bryce Rasmussen on 7/12/2002 at 7:42:53 PM
Hi, am not sure this is the right area, but here goes: I recently recieved an older bike, in need of a little TLC, no problem there, the problem is in identifying year and make. All I know, is on the chainguard, which is original to the bike, it says 'Made In England." The name and make of the bike, on the down tube, is 'Woodward's Altantic.' My guess is somewhere around mid 60's or early '70's, classic musclebike style-one speed with blue metalflake banana seat and apehhanger handlebars. I'm also gonna go look and see if i can find serial numbers, etc., so I can post that. Don't need to know exact year, a rough guess is fine. It's a keeper, it's value is in the nice lines, and the funky look and feel. I will post serial numbers, if i find them. Couldn't find much in the database. If anyone knows anything about these bikes, it would be appreciated, so I can look for parts and such. Thanks. Oh yeah, just e-mail me, and all that.

MISC:   OTHER RIDERS OF BRITISH MOTORBKES AND BICYCLES? posted by: Albert on 7/12/2002 at 7:28:11 PM
I was thinking that there are perhaps other participants on this site both avid motorcyclists and bicyclists who ride British-made or type machines. There are many parallels in the history of both industries.

I have over the years owned a B.S.A. A10 and a Triumph Bonneville. Currently my mount is Kawasaki W650, a machine whose configuration is derived from both B.S.A. and Triumph.

I would be interesred in hearing from others who are drawn toward both the motorized and un-motorized British bikes.

Cheers from Philadelphia!

   RE:MISC:   OTHER RIDERS OF BRITISH MOTORBKES AND BICYCLES? posted by Dewane on 7/16/2002 at 4:16:23 PM
I agree, there are a lot of similarities and many companies (Rudge immeditately comes to mind) made both motorcycles and bicycles. I think the Triumph bike was built by Raleigh and rebadged, wasn't it, so that's a bit different.

Having had many friends who rode British motorcycles, and having had two uncles who rode TT races on BSAs, I got a lesson in British motorcycling. My first ride was on a neighbor's BSA 650 Lightning (A65), on which I burned the heck out of my leg on the exhause pipe.

My dad had a Triumph TR-3 car. That thing was a money pit, he was under it fixing something or other a LOT more than he drove it. And, having seen my friends dealing with British motorcycles that had parts vibrating off due to vibration, parts that shouldn't fail such as rear hubs failing, British Electrics (Lucas - insert your joke here), electrical points that would open at the wrong time due to vibration, the bikes just stopping in the rain (don't you think that British manufacturers would make a bike that would run in the rain), etc. etc. I decided to stick with British bicycles.

The British companies used the same forms and molds for a lot of their parts for many years, by the early '70s the build quality of British motorcycles was highly questionable. And, BSA tried to phase in metric fasteners in the late '60s and early '70s, which means a mishmash of Whitworth and metric (and SAE perhaps?) bolts. An A10 was a good bike, if you don't mind things like aligining the transmission with the motor and adjusting and primary and drive chain.

There's a reason the Japanese took the British motorcyclist's lunch during the '70s. Albert, I think you were wise to get the W650, and I'm very happy with my 750 Katana.

Sorry, I know this isn't British motorcycles, but you really struck a nerve there.

And, on the other hand, BSA was the world's largest seller of motorcycles at one time, and British innovation was strong from the 1900's to the '50s (witness the Scott Squirrel, water cooling in the '20s, and the famous Brough Superior SS100, ridden by T.E Lawrence, and the Vincent Black Shadow, etc.etc.)

Now, could somebody please stop me from going over to Raber's and looking at that Norton Commando in British Racing Green that just has "just a small noise in the bottom end"?

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules posted by: ken on 7/11/2002 at 10:23:43 PM
After reading the Sheldon Brown article on pre-Raleigh Hercules bikes, I looked at this worse-for-wear dreigang with more interest. Sure enough, it has a threaded driver. But the coolest thing is the legend on the Made in Great Britain Dunlop t(y)re: INFLATE HARD - good advice if not carried to extremes.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS: Hercules posted by Chris on 7/12/2002 at 5:47:12 PM
This Hercules 3 speed is the same as an Sturmey-Archer A.W. 3 speed only it is better quaility. Machined instead of pressed steel. The cones are awesome in this hub. The two are interchangable also. I love to de- gunk a Hercules 3 speed hub and run those verses Sturmey even thought they are the same. Hercules guts in a Sturmey Alloy shell!

WANTED:   Frame Clips posted by: P.C. Kohler on 7/11/2002 at 3:04:44 AM
Might as well ask: do any of you kind souls have an extra frame clip for a Raleigh/Rudge/Humber? These are for the 'Superb' models top tube and have a double space for the brake/gear cable and also the wire from the rear dynohub to the handlamp. A lot of 'stuff' that without this special clip looks an unsightly mess!

I can e-mail a pix of this clip if required.

P.C. Kohler, starting restoration a Rudge 1951 'De Luxe Sports Tourist' model no. 124

   RE:WANTED:   Frame Clips posted by Mark R. on 7/11/2002 at 11:43:15 AM
I may have some spare clips. E-mail a photo, and I'll get back to you.

   RE:RE:WANTED:   Frame Clips posted by P.C. Kohler on 7/11/2002 at 9:27:34 PM
Many thanks guys... two most generous replies!

This afternoon, Rudge-Whitworth 'De Luxe Sports Tourist', model 124, serial number 70721 9D, August 1951, makes her first run under new owners.

The condition of this machine is remarkable; except for the replaced saddle bag and a Sears Allstate back tyre and brake shoes, she is wholly original including those big cushy grips. These will have to replaced for regular riding as they are decaying. But kept for the 'archives' and photo ops of course! Best of all: this machine has stainless steel Westrick rims!! Yum. Especially with the dulled spoke centre section. Look as good as the day they left Nottingham 51 years ago.

The only item needing replacement is the handlebar which is bent on the left side.

Thanks again for the kind replies to my frame clip request.

P.C. Kohler

   RE:RE:RE:WANTED:   Frame Clips posted by P.C. Kohler on 7/12/2002 at 12:36:01 AM
Silent. Smooth. Swift. My Rudge De Luxe Sports Tourist passed her first ride with flying colours. Utterly quiet, not a rattle to be heard. The only defect: a squeeky rear brake and a burnt out headlamp bulb. I haven't cycled on a cable brake machine in ages; seemed weird! Give me rod brakes any day. But this is one sweet running Rudge.

I have posted some pix on my Roll Britannia Yahoo Group, under Photo Albums: My British Cycle


P.C. Kohler

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Fender troubles posted by: David Poston on 7/10/2002 at 5:13:47 PM
I tried taking off my rear mudguard to clean and polish . . . Very bad idea, particularly because I don't have the proper wrenches. When I got them back on, I noticed that one side had bent mudguard stays. As a result, the mudguard is closer to the tire, and there is less than a 1/4" gap between the mudguard stays and the rear tire. Is this normal? How much space should there be? (I tried spinning the wheel, and it does clear).

FOR SALE:   WHITWORH SPANNERS posted by: Ian on 7/10/2002 at 9:03:53 AM
Further to the discussion of a few days ago re spanners for English bikes I have checked for David and can still buy Whitworth spanners. The five most common sizes (1/8, 3/16, 1/4, 5/16 and 3/8) came to US$38.75 plus postage. These were reasonable quality Japanese made ones. High quality German made ones were about four times the price. If anyone is interested email me your address and I will get a postage quote. Cheers, Ian.

   RE:FOR SALE:   WHITWORH SPANNERS posted by David on 7/10/2002 at 12:59:11 PM
Here's a link to the first US source I found for Whitworth wrenches, in Washington state. (No relation to me!)

   RE:RE:FOR SALE:   WHITWORH SPANNERS posted by Dewane on 7/10/2002 at 5:39:39 PM
I don't think it's this bad with British bicycles, but check this link re: screwthreads from the BSA Motorcycle Owner's club page. Search for "screwthreads" and you'll find the article.


You thought Whitworth bolt head size was bad, just imagine trying to find out whether your bolt is BSF, BSW or BSC.

AGE / VALUE:   Sturmey-Archer F.M. hub diagram/ interchangability chart posted by: ChristopherRobin2@starmail.com on 7/10/2002 at 12:20:17 AM
Still there is no place on the net where the exploded diagrams and disassembly/ reassembly instructions for the Sturmey-Archer Four speed model F.M. hub are shown.

Now Sheldon's wonderful site has early catalogs scanned in color and it shows this model and a lot of other models too. That's great and it is a peek into a rare catalog but still no exploded diagrams. Not the F.M., Not yet anyways.

Other hubs are covered, especially the S.W. hub. a bit on the B.S.A. hub too. More info is being added every day.

I have exploded diagram sheets, and parts names and an interchange-ability chart for all the hubs. No guide, however on how to overhaul and this is needed.

Are you in possession of a F.M. hub? Need a diagram sheet? interested in what Sturmey- Archer parts interchange?

e- mail me and ask for a free copy.
This is a rare hub, few are in use, but they are out there, in the rear wheels of wonderful bikes.
So many of these bikes have been lost and I'm sure that a lot of really nice club bikes with the F.M. and F.C. hubs have been lost. It's was "just a bike" and "just a old hub." They didn't realize to save it, that one day it would be collectable and sought after.

I got these tins home and picked through them and sat there stunned. N.O.S. brake hardware, Chater- lea, Harden hubs and a British Hub Airlite continental. I thought the guy was crazy for wanting it to go to scrap. I saved them but it was not fun. I had to argue and fight for them. He didn't care, didn't know, was not into these. This is how these vanish, folks don't know.

Check every hub in every bike you can. Look for these, look to see what is stamped onto the hub shell.

A.W. is the common basic hub. Still save these, all you can, there is diffrent years, diffrent drillings, some are diffrent axle lengths, some are alloy shell models.

The A.M. is special, it's a diffrent ratio 3 speed

The F.W. basic four speed. Most folks did not know that the four speed existed. Great hub, extra low gear went in Moultons also. Interchanged with the 3 speed shells, no wheelbuilding.

The F.M. Medium ratio racing hub rare,
F.C. another four speed hub
3 speed dynohub A.G.
4 speed dynohub F.G. looks just ike the A.G. only it has a rod protruding out the axle.
3 and four speed brake hubs, two kinds

older two speed hub, later day two speed hub most are in Scandinavia
front hubs, so much and this is just Sturmey-Archer! That old bike, what is it? What parts does it have? what type hub? Take a look!
Perhaps the owner rode fixed gear and it is single speed.
By the way, the one to find is the Sturmey- Archer A.S.C. a 3 speed fixed and these fetch nice prices!
Look at the catalog scan Sheldon shows us and go hunting.
Bicycle hubs are complicated and wonderful and if you look about you'll see a wide variety. Great to have in the collection, even better to ride! Parts? we can still scare up parts so don't go thinking you can't get it running.

Bruce Robbins was (and still is) selling C.D. copies with two old catalogs of all sorts of goodies shown and the information is great to have. I highly recommend that you get ahold of him and pick up the C.D. he offers.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Sturmey-Archer F.M. hub diagram/ interchangability chart posted by d on 7/10/2002 at 1:27:24 PM
Try Hadland's site for a FM diagram:


& = tilda

AGE / VALUE:   Most wonderful handlebar grips! posted by: ChristopherRobin2@starmail.com on 7/9/2002 at 6:08:48 PM
E- bay item #2120032568 Vintage Humber England 3 speed Bicycle Antique

Well, it's a Humber all right and in that luscious navy blue color and that's nicer than black for that model. In great shape with a 3 speed dyno and battery tube set up. Wonderful! Look at those thick handlebar grips! Ohh, I love these grips! Wonderful. A real treat! Too bad this bike does not have the split double blade fork! Oh well.
Wish we saw more bikes like this! I'll bet it's likely that this has Raleigh stainless steel spokes with the little R's stamped in the spoke heads. Not my auction, no relation to seller, all that.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Most wonderful handlebar grips! posted by P.C. Kohler on 7/9/2002 at 7:02:15 PM
Don't tempt me! Thank goodness it doesn't have an enclosed gearcase or.....

By the way, those great grips are the same as on my 1951 Rudge De Luxe Sports Tourist model no. 154 and were also on the top of the line Raleighs. So this must be the best of the Humbers; possibly just a bit newer hence no enclosed gearcase.

I love the huge "Made in England" script transfer atop the top tube; same as Rudges. The blue colour is delicious. So the best Humbers were blue, the best Rudges maroon and the best Raleighs green.

Best feature of a Humber: that headbadge "By Appointment to H.M. Majesty King George VI". And true too: the Royal Family had a stable of Humbers at Sandringham during the war and there's a great photo of the King and the two young Princesses, Elizabeth and Margaret inspecting the fields at Sandringham c. 1943, asride their roadsters. The Queen, however, was in a trap and pony!

P.C. Kohler

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Most wonderful handlebar grips! posted by Mark R. on 7/9/2002 at 7:44:27 PM
This past weekend I found a 1930's Raleigh Sport with enclosed chaincase, and similar hand grips. Dynohub, battery box, the whole enchilada. I'm waiting to hear if the guy will sell it to me, he says he'll call....
But, you know where that'll probably go:-(

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Most wonderful handlebar grips! posted by Chris on 7/14/2002 at 8:30:20 PM
Bike went for $230.00. I'm not sure if it was a double tube fork model.The picture was no good with the fork.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Most wonderful handlebar grips! posted by Chris on 7/14/2002 at 8:30:23 PM
Bike went for $230.00. I'm not sure if it was a double tube fork model.The picture was no good with the fork.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   1950s Gazelles/Rudges posted by: P.C. Kohler on 7/9/2002 at 4:56:32 PM
Apropos the discussion about Gazelles; I recently got a 1952-ish Rudge catalogue for the US market which is a mate to the Raleigh one I have for the same period. It seems that whilst Robin Hood was the 'budget' line for Raleigh dealers, Gazelle was for Rudge agents. One basic model was offered: no. 222 (boys) and 222L (girls) in 19 1/2 and 21" frame sizes so obviously aimed at the youth market.

As for the main Rudge US line va. Raleigh of the period, it's interesting that Rudge alone offered a 26" wheel rod-braked model to the US market: no. 111, 'Super Safety' which is the same model I have. The Ralaigh catalogue has no rod-braked machines listed at all.

P.C. Kohler