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Archived: English Roadsters

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††AMERICAN STYLE HERCULES posted by: Ian on 2/23/2003 at 8:31:17 AM
Was offered today a bike which has a Hercules badge on it and a Hercules chainwheel but looks like an American roadster. The frame has two small diameter top tubes which curve down as they go back to the seat tube and are attached either side of the tubes. It also has a single tube below these which curves up and back to the seat tube. It has bars that are quite high and swept back and look almost like a low version of chopper bars. I am not very familiar with American frames but this looks much more like an American bike than an English one. Did Hercules make anything like this? It has 26 x 1&3/8 wheels but the front and rear are different rims and I think it would have had a three speed rear originally as there is a Sturmey cable pulley fitted but it is at the bottom of the seat tube just above the bottom bracket. Any ideas? Thanks, Ian.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††AMERICAN STYLE HERCULES posted by Catfood Rob on 2/23/2003 at 9:22:58 PM
Herculese were a Raleigh company. Raleigh produced a lot of cruiser style bikes exclusively for the American Market. This is probably one of them.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS: AMERICAN STYLE HERCULES posted by J. M. Vernooy on 2/24/2003 at 2:08:18 PM
Does the frame look anything like this picture? http://threespeedbicycles.angelcities.com/First_bike1_fin_S.png
It's from my website, sorry. I admit it. The Hercules bicycle in that picture was indeed made for the U. S. market. For Montgomery Wards in 1960. But it came with the Northroad bend handlebars as pictured.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††RUDGE WHITWORTH posted by: Ian on 2/23/2003 at 8:16:13 AM
Acquired recently what appears to be a Rudge, it has the Rudge chainwheel certainly and has been "decorated" with small round Rudge Whitworth transfers in various places but how do I tell for sure? It has 28 x 1& 1/2 wheels but the rims have been replaced by Japanese Westwood replicas of the type I sell (Ukai brand). It has S/A AB drum brake rear hub dated 48 7 and a S/A drum brake front hub which has the number 954 on it. Strange thing is that the front hub does not have any model identification on it, just Sturmey ArcheR (written this way with a capital R at the end) and the number 954 underneath which is not the way they did their dates as I understood it. It has the number A430700 vertically on the top end of the seat tube and only has a hockey stick chain guard. It does not have a headbadge and as it has been brush painted I cannot tell if the holes were there for one. Does anybody have a Rudge serial number list. This one has obviously been rebuilt or hybridised after a fashion but I would like to put a year to the frame if possible. Thanks, Ian.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††RUDGE WHITWORTH posted by Ian on 2/23/2003 at 8:45:33 AM
Forgot to ask if any Rudges or other brands ever had a bracket for a rear light brazed on to the right rear seatstay? This bike has a "lump" attached which has a reflector screwed on to it. May not be original but if not it is fairly professionally done. Thanks, Ian.

AGE / VALUE:†††It still happens !!! posted by: Pete on 2/22/2003 at 9:23:25 PM
It still happens. Last week I found out that a shop in Southend, Essex that had been closed for 15 years was been
cleared. I was invited down and found that during the previous week 6 skips and several van loads had gone to the
TIP. The shop had been the very largest in the area and consisted of three very large showrooms and 8 large lockups plus one large workshop, . I managed to save some of it, but only the tip of the iceburg. Apparently they
had asked around but no one was interested !!!

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††It still happens !!! posted by Mark R. on 2/23/2003 at 2:13:00 AM
Oh my God! I'm gonna be sick! I mean it, I'm gonna puke!
I hear stuff like this and I know that it really happens, and I just get sick.
Didj'a find anything good?

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††It still happens !!! posted by PETE on 2/23/2003 at 8:18:38 AM
Yes There was some usefull stuff. quite a bit of old Sturmey stuff. NOS Raleigh fenders plus others all 1950/60s
A Raleigh RSW folder plus loads of other stuff. The shop opened in 1936 and closed in about 1986 so there was nothing
really new. What went to the tip is too much to think about

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††It still happens !!! posted by Mark R. on 2/23/2003 at 2:41:49 PM
I'm gonna go lay down, and probably cry for awhile.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††It still happens !!! posted by Catfood Rob on 2/23/2003 at 9:24:44 PM
Me too.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††It still happens !!! posted by Chris on 2/25/2003 at 1:25:21 AM

The answers my friend, are blowing in the wind. The answers are blowing in the wind.

AGE / VALUE:†††I still happens !!! posted by: Pete on 2/22/2003 at 9:23:25 PM
It still happens. Last week I found out that a shop in Southend, Essex that had been closed for 15 years was been
cleared. I was invited down and found that during the previous week 6 skips and several van loads had gone to the
TIP. The shop had been the very largest in the area and consisted of three very large showrooms and 8 large lockups plus one large workshop, . I managed to save some of it, but only the tip of the iceburg. Apparently they
had asked around but no one was interested !!!

AGE / VALUE:†††fitting new sprokect and chain posted by: alonzo on 2/22/2003 at 7:48:01 PM
I'm attempting to fit a 21-tooth sprocket on my Phillips. Alas, I appear to be suffering a catch-22. With extra links in the chain, the axle slides all the way back in the drop out, and the tire rubs against the mudguard reflector screw. I take out a chain link, re-tighten the axle, and now the tire rubs at the front end of the mudguard.

With some judicious wheel truing, it might just work. So, what size spoke wrench do y'all use on these tiny Raleigh spoke nipples? Perhaps there's some other solution.


   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††fitting new sprokect and chain posted by Robert on 2/22/2003 at 11:17:45 PM
I ran into the same thing on my daughters bike. You may have to ask around a bit, but you can install a half link.
With the link removed you add the half link and that would move it away from the mudguard. If local bike shops do not have it, check at an industrial bearing and chain supply.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††fitting new sprokect and chain posted by dafydd on 2/23/2003 at 12:49:45 AM
A half link is the way to go if you can find it. Or you can do the quick and dirty, and install a spacer on the reflector screw on the outside of the fender. Don't un-/re-dish the wheel, it'll affect tracking.

   RE:AGE / VALUE: fitting new sprokect and chain posted by J. M. Vernooy on 2/25/2003 at 3:24:32 AM
If you can find a half link? What? Don't you have bicycle shops in your area? Half links aren't obsolete and they shouldn't be rare. A half link is at times the only correct solution, as it is in this case. On many Raleighs and Raleigh built bicycles a half link came on the chain when it left the factory.

FOR SALE:†††Phillips pedals and book for sale posted by: Pete on 2/21/2003 at 6:27:48 PM
Hello all I have found some hens teeth! NIB Phillips 4 inch
white rubber rebuildable pedals . The box says there Tourist
type, but would be perfect for any 1950/60 English roadster
$70 inc post. I've only a few so don't miss them
Also I have an almost mint c1958 Raleigh main dealer catalog for sale. if has a red crocodile cover. It covers the Raleigh and Triumph range. The illustrations (shed loads) are A4 and full color with the bike spec. These things are stunning and very rare.$160 inc post

   RE:FOR SALE: Phillips pedals and book for sale posted by Chris on 2/25/2003 at 11:10:23 PM
I have a article on Phillips and it has photos of the employees making pedals at the Credenda Works.
They made quite a large variety of wonderful pedals.

AGE / VALUE:†††Question on derailleur Superbe? posted by: Robert on 2/21/2003 at 2:02:46 PM
Picked up a pretty nice Raleigh Superbe at Goodwill.
Dynohub, forklock, lights, Brooks 72. But my question is did these come factory equipped with derailleurs. This one has a 5 speed freewheel drop center 40 spoke r.wheel with Huret derailleur and shifter. Brake cables have black housing , but the derailleur cable has a white housing. It has an odd shortened chainguard. It stops about halfway down the chainstay. One of the tabs that is brazed to the downtube for the standard chainguard appears to have been hacksawed off flush with the frame so that this chaingurd could be installed. Were derailleurs a dealer add-on or is this factory? Per the dynohub date it is a 1970 model.

If someone has a standard type 70's green chainguard for cheap, I would be interested. I have a "coffee??" colored one if you would be interested.


   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Question on derailleur Superbe? posted by M.R. on 2/21/2003 at 4:03:01 PM
Nope. This was a home job. Should have been a three speed. You can probably retro fit it to original with little problem.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Question on derailleur Superbe? posted by sam on 2/21/2003 at 10:48:35 PM
Has the braze on for the top tube shifter,Right? That would make it factory,right?---sam PS Will bring over a green hocky stick tomorrow.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Question on derailleur Superbe? posted by Warren on 2/21/2003 at 11:33:05 PM
This was the time period that Raleigh started making the 5 speed Huret equipped Sport bikes. They had the same sports frame...sometimes they had 32/40 EA1 rimsets with SA hubs. And they had that funky short chainguard. The PO may have become jealous of those faster 5 speeds zipping past him.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††What I would do with it posted by Chris on 2/22/2003 at 8:20:45 PM
Remove the rear wheel, set it aside. Get ahold of a Sturmey-Archer 3 or 4 or 5 speed hub is another wheel of the same type. Remove the cog on the hub and remove the dust cap. Buy and install a Cyclo 2 or 3 speed conversion cog. You should be able to get one of those from Cyclart in Vista, California.
Assemble the rear wheel together and pop that back into the frame and keep the Alvit intact.
You'll now have 9 speeds or 12 speeds or 15 speeds.
This is called hybrid gearing.
The bike will now be more fun to ride.
Congratulations on a good find at Goodwill!
If this is a 26 inch wheel bike it has fun possibilities and I keep these intact. I have written before what I do to these Superbes if they have 27 inch wheels.
I grab tools in a flurry these get dissabled and the parts stashed in boxes. Yup!I part them out. And every bike dude that likes these is saying "That idiot!"
However this green mixte frame model has survived.
Perhaps the urge to part out some of these 27 inch wheel Superbes has run it's course. I prefer a 3 speed hub bike any day

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Super Lenton posted by: Peter on 2/21/2003 at 10:41:47 AM
This post refers back to a request from David Rainey for info. on a Super Lenton.
I have a 1955 UK Raleigh catalogue that lists the Super Lenton and it is a very fine bike. The spec. was : -

Frame - 22" and 23" Reynolds 531 double-buttted. Renolds 531 forks.

Wheels - 27" x 1 1/4" High pressure, stainless steel spokes.

Tyres - Dunlop Road Racing.

Gears - 69" and 77.6" fixed.

Chainwheel - 3 star arm.

Chain - Renolds Elite

Cranks - 6 1/2" fluted

Pedals - Raleigh Quill pattern

'bars - Maes 15/16" alloy, adjustable stem, 2 1/2" extension

Brakes - caliper, Light Alloy, hooded levers. Brazed on cable clips.

Mudguards - White Celluloid

Saddle - Brooks B15 Flyer.

Finish - Flamboyant Electric Blue or Royal Carmine, seatstay, chainstay and front fork ends chrome plated.


   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Super Lenton posted by David Rainey on 2/22/2003 at 11:24:42 PM
Thanks Peter. Would you happen to have a scan of this catalog you could send?

MISC:†††I couldn't stand it any longer posted by: Dale on 2/21/2003 at 4:19:18 AM
Winter's been rough here in the northeast. Unlike the coast, though, we (upsstate NY) didn't get the bad storm this week. Here it's been in the 40sF and the roads are dry. I usually don't ride until a rainstorm or two cleans the salt off the roads, but... I took a hour ride on the Superbe (1969, AW x 2) tonight. Ahhhhhhh. And the dynohub lit the country roads nicely, thank you. "You rode in the dark with a 33 year old headlight bulb?" Of course, it's SA's finest.

   RE:MISC:†††I couldn't stand it any longer posted by Marko on 2/21/2003 at 1:40:03 PM
Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, bla bla bla! Lucky bum :-)

AGE / VALUE:†††Pashley posted by: paul on 2/21/2003 at 1:20:35 AM
Restoration Hardware has put their Pashley Roadsters on sale
for $449.00 plus shipping (and tax?). This seems a good deal,
given that Pashley's retail for $650 in UK. All I've heard
is that Pashleys are great bikes. Any comments to the contrary
or additional thoughts. The only problem is that my Raleigh
Twenty,'60 Hercules sports roadster, and two recumbents will
have less garage space. Thanks, paul

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Pashley posted by Mark R. on 2/21/2003 at 2:37:15 AM
It's a great bike for that price for sure! However, it is not the Pashley roadster I slavered over a few years ago.
I'd bet you would be very happy with it! WOW only $20 shipping!!!

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Pashley posted by JimW. on 2/24/2003 at 12:57:13 AM
That's a pretty snazzy tricycle they have, too.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Pashley posted by Chris on 2/25/2003 at 1:11:52 AM
I went into Restoration Hardware and did not see any bicycle in the store on display.
And it is stupid of them not to.

AGE / VALUE:†††Westrick wheel set on e-bay posted by: David Poston on 2/20/2003 at 9:28:33 PM
Didn't someone need a 26 1 3/8 Westrick wheel set at some point?

Here it is:



AGE / VALUE:†††SA 12V dynohub posted by: David Poston on 2/20/2003 at 7:32:51 PM
Peter Paine is selling this wonderful Sturmey Archer 12V dynohub, pre-war vintage. I'm really thinking of getting this thing, but would the wiring be hard to find?

Also, which bikes had these? All I know about these is that they are rare.



   RE:AGE / VALUE: SA 12V dynohub posted by P.C. Kohler on 2/20/2003 at 9:29:31 PM
Now.. this is NICE. And rare. This lamp set was introduced in the 1939 Raleigh catalogue I have although I think production began in autumn 1938.

It was offered on all cycles in the range in 1939 for 25 shillings (yikes!) and the tail lamp was an extra 1/6. In fact the illustration of this wonder shows the headlamp connected directly to the dynohub (the dynamo side on the chainside by the way) and no wiring for the tail lamp.

The only machines fitted with this as standard were the new "Superbe" models (first time I think these were offered) no. 39 and 39L (cable brakes) and nos. 49 (gents) and 50 (ladies) rod brakes. These all had 26" x 1 3/8 wheels and the rod brake machines came in 20", 22" and 24" frames, the cable brake ones in 21" and 23"; so very useful specs. But not cheap: £7. 19 s. 6. and you still had to pay that 1/6 for the tail lamp! Your basic no. 1 Popular then cost just £5 10 s.

What makes this rare is the fact that 12 v. dynohub production ceased at the onset of the war; the 1940 catalogue I have lists instead an 8 v. model. I rather doubt many of these were ever produced.

Me, I just love the headlamp: big, dignified and British to the core!

Good luck, David.. methinks this is going to fetch a lot more than £25 let alone 25 shillings!

P.C. Kohler

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE: SA 12V dynohub posted by humberchristopher28@hotmail.com on 2/21/2003 at 12:27:11 AM
I have two of these. One in use and another mounted for display on the bike.
You'll be really sick at heart if you break that headlamp. It's much worse than breaking a nice set of Blumels mudguards.
I have dropped headlamps before, but never one of these.
Yes, that chrome bezil will be all scratched up and you'll bust the glass with the first mishap. These are one of the most beautiful cycle lamps ever made and so I hope that you'll use caution to keep it intact.
Nothing bites like going out with the bike and comming back with a busted/smashed headlamp. Don't lean the bike, don't rely on the kickstand. Have a real stable dropstand and keep it away from people, kids and dogs.

This will require a new front wheel being built, this is a larger unit than the G.H.6. these are prone to shorting out and you could get zapped too. The headlamp has tangs inside for a battery but these are no longer made? This will be harder to get into working form than the G.H.6.
I have never had wiring made up, nor done that myself. I suppose going to a motorcycle shop?

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE: SA 12V dynohub posted by P.C. Kohler on 2/22/2003 at 6:24:07 AM
Amazing... it fetched only £31 afterall. There's no figuring eBay. If I had a pre-war Raleigh, I'd have gone for broke to get this.

P.C. Kohler, stickin' with the 1948-51 period!

FOR SALE:†††Big Update posted by: VVVintage Vintage Bicycles, Inc. at OldRoads.com on 2/19/2003 at 4:03:05 PM
We've added more bicycles and parts and set some "mid-winter" prices.
Click on "Bicycles for Sale" and "Parts for Sale" at the top of this page.

Vin - VVVintage Vintage Bicycles, Inc.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††London shops posted by: Brian on 2/19/2003 at 12:55:21 PM
Looking for recommendations on bicycle shop/outfit to visit while in London? I'm interested in 1940/50's Sturmey Archer hubs/parts, Club-type bikes, and other English built items from this genre.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††London shops posted by David on 2/19/2003 at 5:19:12 PM
I was attracted to a place called "Recycles" very near Elephant & Castle tube station. Old bikes supposedly, but they were closed when I went by.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††London shops posted by Tim on 2/20/2003 at 1:09:39 PM
Hop on a train to Hook in Hampshire and go to 'Cycles of Yesteryear'. It should only take you about an hour from London. They have everything you are interested in.
They have a web site if you need direections.

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS: London shops posted by P.C. Kohler on 2/20/2003 at 4:27:45 PM
Yes, Tim's recommendation is a good one. Harvey Russell of Cycles of Yesteryear is a good friend to the English roadster and fellow enthusiast. Depending on when you go, say hello to my 1948 Lenton Clubman and 1951 Lenton Tourist which Harvey is restoring for me...

As for London and the big towns in England, the cycle shops I've come across look just like the ones here in the USA alas. I know what you WANT them to look like (all those little yellow Sturmey Archer boxes piled on shelves...!) but I sure haven't found any that fulfill such expectations.

P.C. Kohler

   RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS: London shops posted by David Poston on 2/20/2003 at 7:29:24 PM

Did you actually meet Harvey and visit his shop? If so, please tell us what it was like.

I've never been to England in my life, but if I do I shall have to look him up.


AGE / VALUE:†††Super Lenton posted by: David Rainey on 2/18/2003 at 2:37:10 AM
I have an old English bike with no badgeplate, but it has the model name Super Lenton. Any idea who makes it and what production years it might be?

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Super Lenton posted by David on 2/18/2003 at 12:32:42 PM
Look below at the "Raleigh Clubman" thread. Lotso' info there. Also look in the slightly older postings, there's been a lot of chat lately about bikes like [lucky you!] yours.