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Archived: English Roadsters

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Raleigh LTD posted by: James Biffin on 9/7/2003 at 3:15:09 AM
I've been looking for an old 3 speed Raleigh. All I've found is an LTD model, I think it was LTD-3, made in Malaysia, but nearly identical to the usual Raleigh speed, SA hubs, black paint with white rear fender. What do you know about this bike? when was in made. in the 1970s? was a "retro" model?

Does anyone have an 1960s Raleigh (or Humber) 3 speed for sale?


   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Raleigh LTD posted by Ted on 9/8/2003 at 2:50:15 AM
Have a 66 Raleigh Superbe with the dynohub in decent condition. E mail me if interested.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Raleigh LTD posted by Drew on 9/8/2003 at 11:41:25 AM
I myself found a circa early 70s black lady's Raleigh sports made in Malaysia. I don't know if dealers sold these or owners shipped them over. Value may be a bit less than English made bikes.....people like the "Made in England"!

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Raleigh-Carlton Super Tourer posted by: Greg on 9/6/2003 at 10:07:52 PM
At a church rummage sale, I picked up a vintage Raleigh-Carlton Super Tourer 5 speed with TA crank, Huret derailler, high flange Normandy hubs on 27X 1 1/4 rims, Weinman centerpull brakes, flat touring handle bars, and a Brooks saddle. It has a beautiful Reynolds 531 frame, with chromed forks and chain stays w/Huret touring dropouts. It's a metallic brown color with silver headtube and downtube rings. With the exception of some minor rust on the chrome, it is in excellent condition. When I took it to my local Raleigh dealer he said it was a very rare bike, with probably only about 500 made. The frame number is WH4005138. Does anyone know what year this bike was made? I'm guessing early 70's by the rim size offered with it. And I'm wondering is this really a "special" limited manufacture bike. It rides beautifully with a nice soft touring angled frame, but the bike shop guy said it looked to be a Raleigh Professional racing frame configured with touring frame angles. Can anyone out there help me identify what I picked up? I paid $3.00 if you can believe it, but I know it's worth at least ten times that. Thanks. GREG

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Raleigh-Carlton Super Tourer posted by Mark R. on 9/7/2003 at 5:04:18 PM
HOLY SH**!! 10 times? Try 100 times or more! Yes, it's a fine bike you lucky bum :-)

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Raleigh-Carlton Super Tourer posted by steve on 9/8/2003 at 8:38:37 PM
Looking at my 1973 catalog, I note that the various upper-grade Carlton/Raleighs all differed slightly in fittings. The "Professional" had fastback seat stays, a sloping fork crown, plain lugs, and rather tight layout. The International" had conventional seat stays and fork crown, fancy chromed lugs and has a noticeably longer wheelbase and clearances, and a basic color similar to yours. Both bikes are listed as having Campy dropouts.
The next bikes down were the black "Competition GS", with Huret derailleur and presumably dropouts and a sloping fork crown; and the white/blue Gran Sport with a conventional crown and a Simplex derailleur that the catalog shows mounted on a derailleur boss-presumably Simplex, though all the actual ones I've ever seen (including my own) had plain rear dropouts and used a derailleur mounting plate.
It may indeed have been a limited-edition model, or else the original owner was so in love with the 5-speed derailleur "Sprite" that they had a better-grade bike set up to order.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   SeaPointe, BayPointe posted by: Demarest on 9/6/2003 at 4:42:11 PM
I read in this discussion area, via the search option, about the Baypointe, doublechecked the spelling, found a Huffy SeaPointe, Mixte frame, differentiating it from Baypointes I have seen, 3 speed, coaster brake, light green, that Mixte made that curious. I am aware of the Huffys made in England, I saw nothing immediately to indicate that, however I have seen such Huffys, but not, again from reading this discussion area, with a decal, maybe of the Union Jack on the seat post tube, or something similar.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   SeaPointe, BayPointe posted by Winston on 9/8/2003 at 8:30:28 PM
The hayday, of Huffy Three Speeds ; I don't know where the sellers of Ebay always have these stories with the bicycles. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2191250008&category=420

AGE / VALUE:   Edward in Vancouver posted by: Brian on 9/6/2003 at 12:03:30 PM
Edward - Could you email me..I lost your email address. On this board my attempts to determine your email address have been unsuccessful.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Nice old one the 'bay posted by: Warren on 9/5/2003 at 11:04:29 PM
I might add that it looks like a 26" wheel model. Still nice

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Nice old one the 'bay posted by: Warren on 9/5/2003 at 11:04:29 PM
Here's a nice womens bike...no bids with two days to go.


WANTED:   3 spd Dyno Hub posted by: Tom on 9/5/2003 at 7:17:25 PM
I have a 1972-6 AG 3spd dyno hub with 40 spokes. It is in very nice shape and everything works great. I need a 36 hole for a project. Would anyone have a 36 hole hub or just a shell. I would trade the 40 hole for a 36 hole hub in working order any year is ok.

AGE / VALUE:   Rudge fork posted by: David Poston on 9/5/2003 at 6:38:40 PM
Today I tried fitting on a NOS Rudge lampbracket (probably 50s or early 60s) with the "R" on my 72 Rudge Sports (had to get rid of the non-descript bracket). It didn't work. I discovered that the older Rudge lampbracket has a little notch on it, which prevented it from fitting onto my Rudge fork. Did the older forks have a slot for this notch to index into? I'm thinking of filing off this little notch so it'll work with my fork.


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Rudge fork posted by Tom on 9/5/2003 at 7:27:32 PM
The notch is maybe for a lockring on the fork. If you use it on the newer fork make sure you have the original newer fork lock ring under the lamp bracket. The older fork probably used the lamp bracket for a lock ring. Correct me if I am wrong.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE: Rudge fork posted by Warren on 9/5/2003 at 9:23:15 PM
Tom's right about the notch...it's for a washer that separates the top nut from the cup. The lamp bracket is used in lieu of the washer.If you must have it on the bike, you can easily take a hand file and take the tang off of the bracket. It will make it slightly more difficult to orient the bracket when cinching down the headset...you sometimes need a third hand.

If you were crafty and careful, you could cut the notch into the fork...nahhh...

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE: Rudge fork posted by Chris on 9/9/2003 at 6:52:50 PM
Raleigh advised against filing the lamp brackets. Some safety reason. I can pull up the section and quote it if need be.
I can't remember exactly why they said not to do this.

AGE / VALUE:   b73 vs b66 saddle posted by: saddle guy on 9/5/2003 at 8:39:08 AM
Has anyone found a b73 brooks saddle to be more comfortable than a b66?

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   b73 vs b66 saddle posted by Jeff R on 9/6/2003 at 9:45:03 PM
The B66, B73, and B72 all use the same size saddle. The B33 saddle is slightly wider at the rear, the B90/3 saddle is much larger and the frame heaver. I started using a B33 on my sports bike about 5 years ago and love it. I still have other bikes with the B66 saddle, but the bike that I ride the most has the B33.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   b73 vs b66 saddle posted by Jeff R on 9/5/2003 at 11:17:55 AM
I prefer the B33. The B73 offers more suspension, or spring than the B66, but it can rock from side to side when pedaling.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   b73 vs b66 saddle posted by saddle guy on 9/5/2003 at 4:51:47 PM
How 'bout for a sports bike? Would a b66 be lighter than b73 or b33? You always find b66's on raleigh sports, etc., but never b73's or b33's.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   b73 vs b66 saddle posted by Chris on 9/5/2003 at 5:46:17 PM
The B- 66 has two springs on it. The B- 73 has three.
The B- 33 ? you need to look at the Brooks web site or on e- bay.

I'm spoiled. I went from a Brooks B- 90/3( heavy duty model) to a Brooks B-66 and the B- 66 was not comfortable for me. This wasa going from a heavy duty 3 spring to a lighter weight model 2 spring seat.

Be sure to see wheather or not the B- 66 you are riding is a regular gents B- 66 or if it a ladies model seat. The ladies model seat will say B-66 L L as in ladies.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   b73 vs b66 saddle posted by Jeff R on 9/5/2003 at 7:41:42 PM
The B33 is a light weight version of the B90/3. It is also smaller than the B90/3 but slightly larger than the B66. With two rear coil springs and the clothes pin type front spring it gives a nice ride and is not too large for a sports bike.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   b73 vs b66 saddle posted by saddle guy on 9/5/2003 at 8:03:06 PM
paid a visit to Sheldon's site, and he said the same thing about b73's (rocking from side to side). I don't think I want something so big as a b33 on my Sports. Isn't that kinda heavy? A b66 or b73 seems about the right size. Seems like you would only need a b33 or b90/3 on a roadster type of bike with slack frame angles and a seat much lower than your bars.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   b73 vs b66 saddle posted by Chris on 9/9/2003 at 12:14:31 AM
As long as I am up onto all springs and not on a bare frame in front like with the B- 66
I don't mind the rocking from side to side.
The B- 66 has no front spring.
Everybody is different weights and such decide on what is best for you.

AGE / VALUE:   Pedal sizes for gents vs. ladies posted by: David Poston on 9/5/2003 at 7:39:59 AM
Would these be for gents or ladies? Was there a standard size for each?


I've been trying to figure out for the longest time if I've been riding around with ladies pedals (replacements) on my Rudge Sports.


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Pedal sizes for gents vs. ladies posted by David Poston on 9/5/2003 at 8:35:45 AM
OK, I think I may have solved my question. All of the older, rebuildable, rubber-block pedals in my collection (c. 1950s and prior) are female and uniformly measure 3.5" across the length of the rubber blocks. My Rudge Sports currently wears a pair of these. I'm guessing that a proper gents pedal should have a rubber block that is 4" long. Am I right?

All of my non-rebuildable, icky, reflector-bearing pedals (from the late 1960s on) have a uniform rubber block length of around 3 5/8", regardless of whether they came off a male or female bike. Was this another cost-saving effort on the part of Raleigh Industries--to make unisex pedals that would be trashed rather than rebuilt?


   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Pedal sizes for gents vs. ladies posted by David Poston on 9/6/2003 at 4:37:05 PM
I could be wrong, but in my collection, at least, it appears that a unisex pedal was introduced around the late 60s, at about the time when they started using reflectors on the pedals. Re-check the measurement on your 1972 Superbe and see if the rubber blocks aren't really closer to 3 5/8" or 3 3/4" rather than 4". My '72 mens Rudge Sports has the same size pedals as does my '65 ladies Raleigh Sports, as well as both of my late 1970s DL-1s. These are all the reflector type of pedals with the Raleigh logo on them.


   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Pedal sizes for gents vs. ladies posted by Dick in FL on 9/7/2003 at 3:44:16 AM
The raised rectangle that surrounds the face of the rubber block where it contacts the sole of one's shoe is precisely the same on both the 71 Twenty and 72 Superbe pedals. But the the beveled ends *are* different. The Twenty is a full 4 inches including these ends, and the Superbe is only 3.75 inches overall. Even more interesting is the fact that the rubber blocks on the Twenty pedals are skewered with pins/rivets that are threaded at one end for nuts. Serviceable? The Superbe pins are bucked at both ends. The Twenty pedals are framed with flat retaining plates. The retainers on the Superbe have been stamped into a 3-dimensional shape that is 100% effective in constraining the pedal blocks aginst rotation thereby keeping the reflectors facing a useful direction.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Pedal sizes for gents vs. ladies posted by David Poston on 9/7/2003 at 4:45:44 AM

Do your Twenty pedals have reflectors or no? Do they have the little oiling port hole at the end? It looks like you got the cheap, icky pedals on your Superbe but somehow wound up with the earlier, rebuildable type on your Twenty. Check for the oil port hole, and that should tell us for sure if they are the older, rebuildable type.

I have several pedals (1960s era?) without the little oil port, but with the nuts and flat retaining plates (not permanently fixed in place) like on your Twenty, leaving me to wonder whether these are rebuildable as well.


   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Pedal sizes for gents vs. ladies posted by Dick in FL on 9/7/2003 at 5:15:00 AM
My Twenty and my Superbe both have reflectors on the pedals. My 1969 Robin Hood doesn't. I think pedal rebuildability is somewhat oversold as an advantage. I'll take the securely clamped Superbe pedals. Initial designs of almost anything are frequenly only slightly evolved past the prototypes and reflect the craftsmanship necessary to fabricate them. Eventually the designs get cost-improved for mass production. Footwear is, for the most part, non-serviceable. At $50 new so also is my VCR according to Clark Howard.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Pedal sizes for gents vs. ladies posted by Dick in FL on 9/6/2003 at 5:02:45 AM
Until this thread opened up, my beloved 1969 Robin Hood's 3.5" pedals were an uncomfortable (in both senses) mystery. I could barely keep my feet on them. (I have a 1971`Twenty and a 1972 Superbe both with 4" pedals.) Are you suggesting that I have been riding all this while on a machine of ambiguous gender?

AGE / VALUE:    No icky, possibly stolen Trek for me posted by: Chris on 9/4/2003 at 12:04:48 AM
The bike at the kerb was a ladies mountain bike. I looped around to look at it. The home owner was backing out of the driveway. This bike was not looking very good. Something was wrong. Too new, too nice. Bad bike karma. The spirits said: No.Leave it. The gut feeling type deal.
First, it was a mountain bike. I dislike them, don't mess with them, don't know anybody who would pay for it and even if I did I would not mess with it.
Who knows where it has been!
I'm unhappy that I don't find old 3 speeds. Anyways, the lady told me I could have it. I asked: "What's wrong with it?"
I said that because it is too new, too shiny, unridden and Trek is not a cheap bike.
She said: "My son found it, dragged it home and that we didn't want to fool with it."
Upon hearing that, something said leave it there. There was a overload of bad bike karma. Something was not right. I let it fall back to the ground and left it there. Did not even look it over anymore. I figure, If they don't want it then neither do I and I wonder where he found such a newish model Trek bike in the first place?
It was early and it will likely be gone before the trash truck arrives the next morning. So if the thing is stolen or damaged, (or cursed) it is on them.
I'm just fine leaving it there.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:    No icky, possibly stolen Trek for me posted by Chris on 9/4/2003 at 12:25:51 AM
This wore original factory paint. If it was painted I would not even have looked it over in the first place and kept on going about my business.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:    No icky, possibly stolen Trek for me posted by Demarest on 9/4/2003 at 5:10:13 AM
Au Contraire, Mon Frere!

Reminds me of that song, "And if you listen very hard
The tune will come to you at last
When all are one and one is all
To be a rock and not to roll


There's a lady who's sure all that glitters is gold"

where's my 45 of TEQUILA!!!!

   RE:AGE / VALUE:    No icky, possibly stolen Trek for me posted by Stan the Man on 9/4/2003 at 6:36:59 PM
Finally, Chris, a post I can understand. You did a good thing by letting that Trek be. If all your posts were this clear and didn't diverge into the wacko philosphy you're prone to, the world would truly be a better place. Keep up the good work brother!

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:    No icky, possibly stolen Trek for me posted by Mark R. on 9/7/2003 at 5:09:22 PM
What! Leave out the wacko philosophy? Nonsence old man, wacko away! It wouldn't be worth reading a "Chris" post without some "wacko" philosophy for crying out load. AAAHHHH! (cries out load:-)

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:    No icky, possibly stolen Trek for me posted by Mark R. on 9/7/2003 at 5:09:37 PM
What! Leave out the wacko philosophy? Nonsence old man, wacko away! It wouldn't be worth reading a "Chris" post without some "wacko" philosophy for crying out load. AAAHHHH! (cries out load:-)

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:    No icky, possibly stolen Trek for me posted by Chris on 9/5/2003 at 4:49:29 PM
I will, but I'll redouble my efforts to leave out the wacko philosophy.

AGE / VALUE:   Cable colour for '55 Raleigh Sports posted by: David Poston on 9/3/2003 at 9:30:06 PM
My wife's 55 Raleigh Sports is in need of a replacement SA gear cable, and I can't decide what colour to get. She's been riding around in 3rd gear for some time. The thing that puzzles me is what colour the brake cables are. They are smooth and sort of brownish/tan, not grey, white, or black. Does anyone have any idea what colour they once were before they faded with time?

I did a bit of research on Sheldon's site, and the Raleigh timeline chart shows smooth black or smooth grey around this time period.


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Cable colour for '55 Raleigh Sports posted by Chris on 9/4/2003 at 12:00:21 AM
It is dirty, faded, smooth light blue cable casing. Cable Casing originally meant for and used on the Schwinn's.
It found it's way onto your Raleigh. I have run across this cable before.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Cable colour for '55 Raleigh Sports posted by Edward in Vancouver on 9/4/2003 at 8:26:16 PM
I'm unclear which cable you want to replace. If it's the gear cable, go for it. If it's the brake cables, use modern ones.
The old Raleigh style gear cable housing is made from a spiral strip of steel which is then coated with plastic. This spiral strip has small gaps between the spirals and will compress when under pressure, making it "shrink" when you brake. Usually you get a spongy feeling when you brake hard, especially the rear brake. The newer brake cables are made made with spiral strips as well, but made much better, with no gaps between the spirals, and don't compress. As well they are teflon lined and have very little friction with the cable. Better still is the Shimano cable housing which is made of long strands of wire. This might sound very picky, but when you combine the braking performance of a long-reach single pivot caliper with regular shoes, compressing brake cable housing with friction on the cable, AND a steel rim, it could mean the differance of a pleasant ride home or not.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Cable colour for '55 Raleigh Sports posted by David Poston on 9/4/2003 at 8:33:23 PM
I'm looking to replace my SA gear cable (trashed) with an NOS SA gear cable. I'll leave the brake cables alone for now. I was trying to figure out what colour the brake cables were (should be grey or black) so I could match the SA gear cable with them. I don't think they were ever blue, because they are now a goldish-brown colour--unless they did some major colour changing over the years.


   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Cable colour for '55 Raleigh Sports posted by Chris on 9/5/2003 at 12:34:39 AM
Get a little bit of degreaser and wipe it down and then tell us. I might be wrong.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Cable colour for '55 Raleigh Sports posted by Peter on 9/5/2003 at 10:55:53 AM
David - I recently had a new Raleigh brake cable made up for a '54 Rudge. The originals were the golden brown colour you describe. By prising back the metal ferule at the brake lever end of the cable we could see the original colour had been silver grey. The guy who made the cable for me found a Shimano outer cable that was a very good match. Hope this helps, Peter.

AGE / VALUE:   WOOD RIMS posted by: Ric Sona on 9/3/2003 at 6:45:58 PM
Anybody need these???not my auction.


MISC:   Utility roadster at Heart posted by: Robert on 9/3/2003 at 12:46:19 PM
I wish it had a larger frame.


AGE / VALUE:   Hercules bike questions posted by: Robert on 9/3/2003 at 12:30:06 PM
A number of folks at work have started training / riding to get in shape for an MS 150 ride here in S. Texas. A friend brought in his Hercules roadbike. He bought it new in about 1973. It is extremely clean . Nice metallic red. Wrights leather saddle, Allivet??? deraillers and shifter, drop bars. He asked me if it had any value and should be left alone, or should he just start upgrading it. I didn't have a clue . So that is why I am asking here.

Would it be worthwhile to leave it unmolested or is it just a decent utility bike that can be upgraded without fear?


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Hercules bike questions posted by Chris on 9/3/2003 at 6:40:41 PM
Old bike people say the word: "unmolested" as a way of describing the condition and the history of the bike being discussed.
An unmolested bike is a bike that is original as it came from the factory. Parts have not been switched, It is complete and intact. Nobody has been messing around with it. No dents , no damage, no rust anyplace.

Still myself, Even though I am old enough to handle terrible sounding words, I just don't like hearing that word (and probably a few others) For no particular reason, I just don't like hearing it. It is an accurate term because sometimes the bike is not N.O.S. in original packaging, it has been ridden slightly.
Still would like to hear it described differently.
But how?
Unfortunitly, I can't coin up another brief term that applies as well and people are still going to say this anyways.
This means that the bike has not been driven into kerbs and the rims are not damaged up. No kissed kerbs. The fork is in line and true and not out of track. This may also mean that when you ride it it should glide along with your hands off of the handlebars. A bike with a bent fork or whacked wheels with rims that have dent spots/ "kissed kerbs" could mean it is in molested shape.
Still when people use the word it means that the bike has not been fooled with and it means that you are getting a bike that has not been mucked with/ modified worked on by a poor, amature-ish bike mechanic until you got ahold of it.
When I hear the word "unmolested" it is all the more reason to snap it up and get it into my bike fleet so nobody will ever mess up the bike.
We looked over the bike that he called me in to see and buy. I said: "Describe it another way! It's clean, it's original, it's rare, intact and just dusty."
People don't say "intact" they say "unmolested"
He said: "It's unmolested, and I want $675.00 for it!"
(A.S.A.P. too)
From the shop/dealer standpoint, "The only good bike is a sold bike!"
I did not have to go into all this. Probably at least most all of the folks here know what the terms we use mean.
Still, there is no (is there?) bike- lingo dictionary posted on the web and that would be a neat project.
Terms like "kissed kerbs" and such.
Sheldon has a bike dictionary of sorts at his web site but I don't know if terms like "kissed kerbs" is in there.
Perhaps it is the applying of a word that denotes true evil activity/behavior to the world of old bikes that bothers me. The two do not go together and I guess that's it.
Still, the real world is the only world we get to bike around in and unfortunitly, that word and more is out there. I'm thankful for the grace and the gifts. All of many bad things that have not been visited on me and I'm hopeful that we all get through life without hitting too many kerbs along the way.
(Geez, I got all rambling and philosophical, didn't I?
Sorry, not good!)

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Hercules bike questions posted by Chris on 9/3/2003 at 6:49:18 PM
Does it have Reynolds lightweight 531 frame tubing?
If so it is worth something, more than a common ten speed.

If you are going to ride it, there are better brakes and gears and rims and modern tires to be enjoyed and used.
Somebody said that the old frames with the new more modern componets make a great combination.
The Alvit is collectable and they sell for 5-50 on e- bay but I would just set aside the parts you replace and save them.
By 1973, Hercules was just a name on a B- grade Raleigh made bike.
Unless this name was stuck on a lightweight 531 Reynolds frame and this did happen. I have seen marvelous frames wearing the Dunelt name and other names too.
With modern 700 C rims and tires and todays brakes this could be a real joy to own and ride.

   RE: bike slang posted by Rif Addams on 9/5/2003 at 2:44:25 PM
I don't know Chris,
I must admit that I use that term as well, but can clearly see your point.
One of my good frinds tends to use a term I find very uncomfortable to describe a bike that has been stripped of parts for use on another bike. She uses the term "raped". I feel about this 'phraseology' how you seem to feel about the term "molested" in describing a bike that has had parts replaced.
It makes me shudder with discomfort when she says this. I just don't really care for it.
A new glossary of bike slang is not a bad idea, it's actually a pretty cool idea... Hmmm, perhaps you should work on this.

   RE:RE: bike slang posted by Chris on 9/5/2003 at 4:45:07 PM
Anybody else who wants to take up this project is welcome to the idea.
I may get around to putting something together.
Perhaps we could all contribute something here and post it here at oldroads.com Call it: "Bike language" Or, Bike lingo.
All of the industry and shop phrases, terms, historical and slang. I would like to see that.

I have a old book and the dude pieced together a glossery of terms from his experiences and it gave me the idea to do this with bikes.
I agree with you 100%
I don't know how to describe my feelings on this any better. This is a creepy subject that give me shudders and I kinda wish I had not gone into it.
There are some words that should not be lifted up with Silly Putty and stretched and used elsewhere I believe.
People are into bikes for exercise and for restoration and fun and to make a buck and it is escape for some too.
Some words are too harsh and they don't fit well.
We all tailor this to meet out own individual needs and likes and dislikes.
Sorry if I made you shudder.