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Archived: English Roadsters

AGE / VALUE:†††SA drum brake candle holders posted by: James on 1/12/2004 at 7:32:50 AM
For no good reason I decided to take apart my rusted beyond repair drum brake hub and tried to clean it out again. As I was doing this it occured to me that what I had in my hand was a modern art candle holder. Put the thing on a table, drum brake side down, stick a candle in it and you can have a romantic dinner of scotch eggs and Newcastle and it's the only candle holder with bearings for low friction candle spin. All I need now are some Lucas King of the Road candles made out of "rhodesian" blue bees wax or something.

The inside of hub is covered in rust, what sort of paint should I use to cover this? rustoleum?

If anyone has a rusty old drum brake hub they want to get rid of (damaged on the inside not too rusty outside) I will take it.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††SA drum brake candle holders posted by Edward in Vancouver on 1/12/2004 at 11:45:17 PM
S/A hubs are never too rusty to salvage. First try to remove the rust with a wad of aluminum foil, sounds crazy, but it really does "erase" rust marks. Next in line comes a Dremel tool or the like with a flap-wheel sanding head. You can always gloss the hub over with aluminum paint.

P.S. I've got a "resurected" 1940's drum hub on my daughter's RSW 16, and even I, with a packsack full of library books, can lock the brake and leave a decent skid mark on the sidewalk...

AGE / VALUE:†††Sometimes ya gotta wonder! posted by: Larry "Boneman" Bone on 1/11/2004 at 11:12:04 PM

I've studied the dark, DARK picture... and re-read the consummately BRIEF description of the bike being offered and I can't figure it out. Perhaps those bidding have emailed the sellor and found out more about this bike than meets the eye?

Anyone here have a clue as to why this Sports is bid up over $200?

What did I miss? No chaincase... I don't THINK there's a dynohub, but there very well could be in the rear.

Oh well... If I were to sell any of mine, I would be happy te get HALF that!

Methinks someone recently stated that Ebay is for the sellor.... I'm beginning to concur!


Larry "Boneman" Bone

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Sometimes ya gotta wonder! posted by GMS on 1/11/2004 at 11:55:14 PM
I dont see a dyno device anywhere on it...but there is a light. Looks like its in real great shape...the price is steap tho, but it did start at $35, somebody wants that bike bad id say.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Sometimes ya gotta wonder! posted by David on 1/12/2004 at 3:10:18 AM
You can send email to each of the "losing" bidders and offer them YOUR bike - all four seem willing to pay over $100 for a Sports!

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Sometimes ya gotta wonder! posted by Chris on 1/12/2004 at 7:39:19 PM
A Raleigh Superbe it is not.

No locking fork, no bell, it does have the Pletcher rack and a basket. No dynohub light kit. The chainguard being original? well....

It's black. the common color. Basic 3 speed hub, steel shell. Usuable and rideable yes. I'll bet the front hub has all dried out grease and has worn cones with grooves and or pits in the cones. He says he rode it all over. Yes it's a reliable wonderful little bike that is a joy to ride. Yes, that's true.
Still, I think I know what the hub cones will look like.
This has not been "hopped up" as it is still wearing the basic steel rims the thing came with originally.

This bike needs 8 hours of "total makeover"
Imagine the bike off to ..... "The Spa" with mechanics scurrying all around trueing wheels and re-habilitating the paint with Kiwi Shoe polish.
Does this have reflectors in the wheels? I forgot to notice.

I'm spoiled, I know. I' ve seen and owned these in most all the various guises and I've had my way with too many.
What ya wanna look for is the 531 Club machines with their lightweight tubing and Dunlop Alloy rims. All tricked out with the exotic Sturmey- Archer F.W. OR F.M, gears. Bells, lights, British flags, or Mascots, lighted doohickey's
Space capsules, Koba- Kobatnick spinning thingmajiggers that light up.
Speedometers, mudflaps, a rear tool bag or large bag with tools a plenty all a jingling inside!
The bike that is responsive and quick. Something to tear out on and have fun rippin the cat with!
I'll take the 531 Club bikes anyday!

Yup, you think it's a Raleigh Sports over the phone until you see it! and then it's a Lenton Sports with the lightning bolt decals!

I just hope that the buyer is aware that the rear cogs are a thing that can be changed. It can go up to a 24 tooth cog or as small as a 14 tooth cog. The cog that is on the rear wheel it is not a thing set in stone. You remove that circlip and drop in another larger cog and add a few links of chain and all of a sudden, it's really more enjoyable.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Sometimes ya gotta wonder! posted by Chris on 1/12/2004 at 7:43:41 PM
No stainless steel spokes either. By 1964 all the cool candy had been discontinued.

Keep looking for these because these are still being tossed out into the trash.
Thing is, I never find these anymore. Well, 2 years ago at a garage sale for 25.00.
I love these bikes and always will.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Sometimes ya gotta wonder! posted by Matthew on 1/12/2004 at 8:16:22 PM
This cycle would struggle to make £10 at our local auction. They still get dumped in skips (dumpsters) and they don't really rouse any interest this side of the pond.
There remain a great number of old folks riding these to the local shop and supermarket. They stagger home with carrier bags hanging from the handle bars and lurching from the supermarket basket tied to the rack over the rear wheel. The Miller dynamo ate its way through three Raliegh Record tyres before being ditched and they don't venture out in the dark anymore. When the going gets tough the old folks use the cycle as a zimmer frame to give them the confidence to walk to the shop, then it becomes a trolley to get the bags home. As time marches on and the poor elderly person joins their peers in the graveyard the cycle becomes part of the house clearance, the auctioneer's men decide it might sell and the dealer picks it up for £2 at the sale. He carts it away in his van to sell on for use by a student at university. (There is some 'chic' element to not owning a mountain bike) The student doesn't lock their ride and three yobbos steal it, ride it to death and leave it either in the river or on the railway (railroad) to disintegrate beneath the wheels of a train. Such is the destiny of a machine like this, unless some one puts it on eBay?

Matthew, certainly not my auction. Enjoy what you ride and ride what you enjoy.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE; A quest to save the old Brit bikes posted by Chris on 1/14/2004 at 5:37:00 PM
Excellent message. Many of them will still be clutching the darned thing even after they are cold. The heirs will have been told " Do not sell it" or "Do not sell it to Chris!"
either way, don't count upon their death to speed up you getting the bike! Perhaps they are also clinging onto it because it is something that has been a part of their world all their life. It is familiar and reliable and basic. It fits the bill. There is something to these old bikes that the people that are heaving them into the skips are missing. It's a real shame because the magic is right there before them and they're heaving it out anyways. It's not about the money offered. So many times they won't sell it no matter how much. They dismiss me with a wave of the hand and I stand there putting the bills back into the billfold.
Buy my Raleigh?
My Brooks saddle or my Brooks Bag?
My Carridice bag? He looked at me like I was a plum crazy fool, crazy for even suggesting it.
I 'd like to tell the folks who are heaving these out about the utter crazy hell I go through to buy one of these and here they are tossing it out. All the people who told me to "take off" as they give me the finger. Buy the old English bicycle? Are you crazy? No! It's not for sale! I'll carry off the wives and daughters and sisters( The real pretty ones, too!) before they let me have their bike!
I can close my eyes and remember the one man who stood there and wept tears as he said goodbye to his Humber. It made me shudder. He was really upset. I asked "Are you sure?" You don't have to sell it, you know.
He was not poor or broke rather kinda well off. He was just too old to ride it anymore and I was the good home he wanted it to go to.
He wiped the tears away, cleared his throat, took my money out of my hand and bid us farewell.
And yet these things get thrown into dumpsters and skips.
Next time they heave something out will they stop and take a look at the the thing. I think these people are ignorant and have no eye or taste or appreciation of.... history? art? I dunno, no class at all!
I do have taste, and an eye for things.
I want to ask the dumpster heaving idiots this.
"What in life makes you stop and say: Whoa! as they sit there stunned drinking in the mojo or magic or funkyness?"
What turns you on? What are your passions?
Now why can't you see this in the old bikes?"
Another thing. I am trying to find a certain bike, a famous one, one written about and featured and it was like the fellow's mistress. The dude was famous!
The family has no idea where it is or what happened to it.
"Probably in a junkyard somewhere but that's just our speculation" The man was with that bike more than his wife while he was alive.
Where is it? Probably got tossed out. It's just a bike. Still to me, It's something I want to have, it goes with the book and it is a rare and valuable machine but it's not that. I just want to solve the mystery and own it. I screamed at reading the e- mail message! I am going to travel and meet with them and go door to door. I'm going to not give up. It's detective time!
I still love and collect these bikes fiercely. I go looking everyplace I can think of where I may find one of these.
I overhaul every one of these that I find. Clean and polish and true them.
I sit and read Mathew's letter and deep in me I long to know where exactly it is that these are really being thrown into skips. The exact location and I drool and wonder what all is being thrown out. Just how tasty and mystical and what componets and parts and just what all I could rescue. I'd be like a kid in a candy store and I would go thru incredible lengths to bring it all back.

The number one reason is before all others is that.

I love these bikes, I want to check them out, look them over and re- pack bearings and keep them and yes, ride them!

Sure it's nice to sell one and make a buck but I just am addicted to these. It is something I want to chase and grab and experience and I have had adventures in doing so and hope to have more.
I'm cross and sorry that I missed the times in which these were made and popularly ridden. I wish I was way older than I am now!
The destiny of these bikes varies. It depends who is there too see it and who does not. Who has an eye for these and who does not. I met a guy the other day who is completely sold out to these old bikes, another one promising to save every one of these that he can.
One day, it'll be me who staggers home with the bike carrying my groceries. The sure, stable, best friend who's handlegrips I'll be clutching. Better the old Raleigh Sports than some China junk mountain bike.

Yes, what will this generation have in their hands when it's their time to hobble off from the corner store to the cemetary? At least the old folks who are doing it now and have already done it are going out in style.

I think we are heading into another dark ages. I sense it.
It's difficult for me to put it into words. Just look around you.
Anyways, Mathew, Where is it that these are being thrown out into skips? Tell me please. I must go there, immediately.
I am not finding any in my area anymore and to hear about all the cool stuff that gets tossed away is like rubbing salt in my wounds.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE; A quest to save the old Brit bikes posted by Chris on 1/14/2004 at 5:43:53 PM
What exactly is it that DOES rouse interest on Mathews side of the pond? anyways?

   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE; A quest to save the old Brit bikes posted by Tim Powell on 1/15/2004 at 11:54:07 AM
Well Chris old Raleighs do not rouse much excitement over here unless they are pre 1930. I am inundated with the dam things. Now that people know I am the 'Crazy Guy' who collects old bicycles they have taken to dumping them on the front drive of my house and even dropping them over the hedge at the back. My wife is becoming fractious because of this. I usually take off any bits that may be good and dump them. Occasionally though I get something really good and then I try and find out who left it and offer them something. The latest good find was when an old lady from our church gave me her fathers old bike. She is 86 years old and the bike was a 26" frame Starley, not bad for nothing. This I will restore carefully. I think you will have to emigrate to the UK if you want to find more machines cheap.



AGE / VALUE:†††1974 Holdsworth Professional posted by: Alan on 1/11/2004 at 5:46:07 PM

I apologize if this is the wrong forum, but I would appreciate some information about my old bike.

This is a Holdsworth Professional from 1974 that I special ordered while living in England: 26" with short wheelbase, DB Reynolds 531 with decorative cut lugs, in black rather than team colors and without chrome rear forks, all Campagnolo Nuovo Record except the brakes which are Universal sidepulls, Cinelli fork, Campagnolo seat post, quick release seat adjuster, and Campag handlebar shifts. The Super Champion rims on the small diameter Campag continental hubs still have the original clincher tires! Original brakes pads and even the cloth handlebar wrap! Brooks Professional leather saddle is very nice.

Mileage is less than 500 from new. This bike has almost no mileage as I moved between England and both coasts of the US so the bike has almost always been somewhere else. Now I live in a place where riding anything smaller than a Ford Explorer is too dangerous. And add 30 years and 30 pounds to me!

I am out of the current bicycle world and don't have a clue as to the value and desirability of this one. I can't really find comparable items on Ebay or through Yahoo, forum searches etc.

Do you have any ideas as to the current value and a good venue to sell this? Would a little later- Spring- be a better time to sell this one?

Thanks very much for your advice!

Los Angeles

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††1974 Holdsworth Professional posted by Dan on 3/12/2006 at 11:03:46 PM
Hi I own a 1970's Holdsworth and am having some seatpost diameter dilemas, can you tell me what size yours was is? I was under the inpression they would be 27.2 dia. maybe this is not the case
many thanks
London UK

WANTED:†††Information on Lenton Grand Prix posted by: P.C. Kohler on 1/11/2004 at 5:35:54 PM
Anyone out there have a copy of a Raleigh catalogue c. 1960-61??

I am keen to see a picture and specs for the Raleigh Lenton "Grand
Prix" offered that year ('61 was the last year for the Lenton in the
UK). In particular I need to ascertain which brakes were specified. I
think it was GB Sports but possibly GB "66" centre-pulls for the '61
model in question.

If you have a copy, I'd really appreciate a scan. Or if you don't have
a scanner, just a synopis of the specs would be MOST appreciated.

Many thanks

P.C. Kohler

AGE / VALUE:†††Pump pegs? posted by: sam on 1/11/2004 at 5:32:00 AM
Seems they went from behind the seat tube to front then to the down tube then they jumped to the bottom of the top tube ,disapeared and returned to the down tube.???

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Pump pegs? posted by Matthew on 1/11/2004 at 10:05:02 AM
Whta about the natty pumps with shaped ends which fit into the frame (look no pegs) between bottom tube and cross bar. Personally I like my pumps pegged and behind the seat tube.
Matthew - a Bluemels fan.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Pump pegs? posted by Catfood Rob on 1/12/2004 at 7:26:05 PM
Halfway house....my 1978 mixte has a top pump peg and an odd pump that has a normal top for the peg, and a weird bottom that hugs the frame tubes needing no peg.

AGE / VALUE:†††Pump pegs? posted by: sam on 1/11/2004 at 5:32:00 AM
Seems they went from behind the seat tube to front then to the down tube then they jumped to the bottom of the top tube ,disapeared and returned to the down tube.???

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Pump pegs? posted by Chris on 1/11/2004 at 9:54:12 PM
One folding bike I have has the pump conceiled in the bike's inner frame tubing so it is hidden.

MISC:†††prices of parts posted by: J. M. Vernooy on 1/11/2004 at 4:23:22 AM
Happened again. Ebay bidders ran the price of $20.90 worth of AW hub parts up to $22.15. It's auction #2215416834 just ended. Consists of one left axle nut, one right axle nut, two axle washers, one indicator spindle, and one anchorage for cable. I'm not talking about rare items that can and should sell for as much as the buyers are willing to pay. These parts all appear to be nearly new vintage. Of course the anchorage for the cable is fairly recent vintage. Wasn't it the 1970's when the cables were given a removeable anchorage instead of the permanently attached attachment/adjustment barrel.
All of these parts can be purchased from bicycle shops either on line or local.
I'm not blaming the seller. He appears to have set a reserve price of $10. That would have been a certain bargain. But auction frenzy took over and the bidders may not have known that they could have bought these parts for less than the winnning bid almost any day.
But bidders need to know the going price of what they are going to bid on before they bid and then stop there. But you can see parts that aren't rare at all often sell for as much as double their actual value in auctions. No one in these discussion areas at this site would be fooled. But others are often not so lucky.

   RE:MISC:†††prices of parts posted by James on 1/11/2004 at 6:06:41 AM
Those parts might cost me $2 at the local bike shop. I've come to the conclusion that ebay is a place for selling not buying.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Cold Hubs posted by: J M Vernoooy on 1/7/2004 at 3:35:55 PM
Asking if anyone has ever encountered trouble with SA hubs in cold weather. I've been riding in cold weather, 20 degree F and below with an S5 and AW hubs and have not had trouble even when the bike has been out for hours before the ride. Was wondering if anyone has had any trouble with these hubs when cold.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Cold Hubs posted by Ed on 1/7/2004 at 4:29:32 PM
Doesn't often get down to 20% here, however we did wake up to an unusual 24% this A.M.To answer your question,however, I've been riding almost exclusively between Nov. and late April on Sturmey Archer and even one Shimano three speed hubs without any problems.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Cold Hubs posted by Ed on 1/7/2004 at 4:40:38 PM
OOPS:forgot to mention that my winter experience with three speeds goes back for many years,more than I can accurately recall.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Cold Hubs posted by David on 1/7/2004 at 6:37:56 PM
I have a hub that seems to have sticky pawls (no grip) in cold weather. I've never had it apart and I expect to find gummy crud inside. The worst problem seems to be brakes; the upside-down open-frame cable routing gets ice in the bottom of the loop and the rear brake won't release.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Cold Hubs posted by Matthew on 1/7/2004 at 8:40:49 PM
Yes I've suffered the frozen brake situation too. On my Triumph Traffic Master which I rode through the 70s and into the 80s. It had the inverted tail to its rear brake cable which when parked outside, only as a necessity, would fill with moisture which then froze solid. Most often the brake would freeze in the'off' position which meant I was mobile but I have known it to pull up and seize on because the return springs in the caliper couldn't return the tightened cable (tight against the ice in the outer cable). This poor design doesn't effect any rod braked roadsters but many Raleigh TI family cycles are designed this way not a good idea. I tried rubber caps on the end of outer cables but the only thing whcih was anywhere near to effective, was to throughly fill the cable with oil, over a matter of week and then squish grease into the very end to act as a seal, this was a reasonble success. I don't know whether it would have worked for Capt Scott and Capt Oakes but it did for me.
Wrap up warm and keep well greased.

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Cold Hubs posted by P.C Kohler on 1/7/2004 at 8:49:14 PM
My cold weather problems are with another Sturmey-Archer product: the 1949 GH6 front dynohub on my Rudge Super-Safety. Take her outside on a ride: brilliant, steady light. Park her somewhere for 20 mins. Ride home in utter darkness. Bring her inside for 5 mins. (tops) and the lamp burns bright again. Contacts cleaned and checked ad nausea. Moral to story: it's too bloody cold to go cycling so stay home where it's warm and bright!

P.C. Kohler

   RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Cold Hubs posted by Larry "Boneman" Bone on 1/10/2004 at 12:55:42 AM
P.C., I absolutely must concur. Forecast for my area (Northeast PA) is calling for record overnight low of -10 F. If I were to even contemplate taking any of the velocipedes out for an evening cruise, I daresay that stuck gears would be the LEAST of my worries!

La... la... la.... later!

Larry "Boneman" Bone

   RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS: Cold Hubs posted by J. M. Vernooy on 1/10/2004 at 3:33:34 AM
Here in SE New York it is also too cold to ride tonight,(below 0 degrees F). The reason that I asked the question is that I have gotten the impression that these hubs that others might call "old technology" actually work better in all weather conditions than the "new technology" indexed derailleur types. There are people that I have talked to that ride bicycles in all weather. One of them was out with his Sturmey Archer three speed hub equipped bicycle this morning when it was 12 degrees F. His bicycle was working just fine. Yet others with derailleur gears have trouble shifting thoughout the winter whenever the temperature drops to the 20's or below. That may not be pleasant riding weather but if the machinery can tolerate any weather that we could want to take it into then the design definitely deserves respect.
One morning earlier this week I was riding a Raleigh Sprint with an S5 hub. The temperature was around 20 F and the bicycle shifted just like it does at warmer temperatures.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS: Cold Hubs posted by P.C. Kohler on 1/10/2004 at 6:00:40 PM
No, J.M. your point is well taken.. I honestly cannot imagine any climate as diverse as here in Washington DC and I also cannot imagine a S/A gear, in otherwise sound condition and properly lubricated (with S/A oil of course!) wouldn't operate fine regardless. Dynohubs are a different matter I fear but it's more an issue of contacts etc. than design.

P.C. Kohler, who cycled to the barbershop this morning on his trusty '49 Rudge Super Safety. Temperature: 12 degs. f.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS: Cold Hubs posted by Warren on 1/10/2004 at 6:35:13 PM
My commute is short...about 5 kms but I did it in -24 C (-11 F)plus wind chill yesterday. My fixed Super Course sits on the porch all night...the headset grease was starting to freeze! The front wheel was a little reluctant to turn at first.

3 layers of quality warm clothing, (Polartec, fleece etc) and wind shells and it was OK. You just can't have any exposed flesh at these temps. There's no such thing as bad weather, only bad clothing as the Danish are fond of saying.

AGE / VALUE:†††Wrestling with your DL-1 posted by: David Poston on 1/6/2004 at 7:31:52 PM
Has anyone else nearly resorted to curses whilst trying to wrestle their DL-1 into an upside-down position? I can manage my 26" wheel "Sports" bikes, but getting my DL-1 into a workable position has always been near impossible, unless my wife is standing nearby and can lend me a hand. I've tried mounting my DL-1 on my Park work stand, but I believe that the clamp is now bent from the weight. I guess these stands weren't meant to tolerate 50 lbs of Sheffield steel.

Any solutions?


   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Wrestling with your DL-1 posted by Larry "Boneman" Bone on 1/7/2004 at 10:59:57 AM
David, I too have had "fun" with the DL-1. Not ever having anything of that size before, I approached the initial upending of the bike with not just a little trepidation. However, I found a methodology that works for me and will describe it for you.

Stand next to the bike on the LH side (RH if your left handed I guess) facing perpendicular to the centerline. Just ahead of the seat actually. Then what I do is bend over the top tube of the bike, reach down with my right hand and grab the seat tube just above the chainguard. Grab the front wheel with the left hand as well to stabilize it.

Then I just stand up and lift the bike at the same time kind of "barrel roll" the bike in a way. Usually the seat will kind of drag down the front of my body and that kind of helps to maintain a little control over the speed of the "roll". The front wheel will turn this and that way, but should find it's own "center" as you do this. Suggest that the first couple of times you do this, you have a "spotter"? Don't know myself if that would help as I did not have a spotter myself....

Yes, it's a heavy machine, but that method happens to work for me.

Good luck!

Larry "Boneman" Bone

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Wrestling with your DL-1 posted by Ed on 1/7/2004 at 4:53:50 PM
I've attached a car rack to the chain link fence that borders our driveway,where I usually work on my bikes. I've found it to work quite well at holding any of my bikes,DL1 encluded, while I work on them.I don't like to up end my bikes anyway since most of them have computers mounted on
the handlebars so that I can keep tabs on daily milage.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Wrestling with your DL-1 posted by marc on 1/7/2004 at 7:39:15 PM
I agree with the bike rack idea. I work in my garage and I drilled to bike hooks into a wood column and then put the bike rack on the hooks enabling me to get around to both sides of the bike. Works pretty well for me, just becareful not to scratch the top tube.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Wrestling with your DL-1 posted by Ralph on 1/7/2004 at 8:49:12 PM
Park PRS-5 repair stand. Once you use a real stand, you'll never go back. I personally have the PRS-2 It's a bit of overkill, but what the heck. If you're going to devote yourself to a hobby you might as well have nothing but the best. I also have the PRS-5. It's a good stand that folds up into a nice compact little bag. I've found it to be sturdy enough for most repair work. I wouldn't try doing frame straightening on it, but most tune up / minor overhaul stuff will be loads easier with a real stand.

AGE / VALUE:†††Wanted 23inch Raleigh "sports" bike posted by: James on 1/6/2004 at 3:17:26 AM
I'm looking for a 23 inch Raleigh "Sports" frame bike, ideally a BSA
would consider another make, for restoration project. Also looking
for good BSA headbadges and SA front lamps (the all chrome type. And
I am still looking for a pair of fenders for my dad's 26" wheel

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††Wanted 23inch Raleigh posted by Schwinnderella on 1/6/2004 at 6:22:42 PM
James,where are you located,I have a BSA that might interest you ,but would prefer not to ship. I am in the suburban Chicago area.thanks

AGE / VALUE:†††1970's ? raleigh sports posted by: marc on 1/5/2004 at 11:00:02 PM
I have a raleigh sports on ebay right now and was wondering if you all could help me date it. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2215587354&category=420&rd=1

It's blue and silver, the paint is great, hardly any scratches. There doesnt appear to be a date on the sa hub. It has cottered cranks and reflector pedals. There is also a sticker on the frame:"Ti-Raleigh Limited 2030 high tensile Balanced Steel Tubing" It has the red raleigh "R" bolts as well. I'm guessing its from the seventies but I'm not sure. I've got the buy it now set at 150.00 Is this a fair price? pics in the auction.

Also, no one's responded to my post on my 51 schwinn traveler. I would appreciate some feedback on that as well.
Thanks a bunch.

   RE:AGE / VALUE: 1970's ? raleigh sports posted by Warren on 1/5/2004 at 11:20:26 PM
Late 80's at the earliest and even nineties is my best guess.

Value is in the eye of the beholder/buyer. That alone determines the price. In my neck of the woods it's a $20 garage sale find but don't let that stop you. It certainly isn't worth a high (or any) reserve...shipping bikes isn't cheap.

In my opinion Sports models aren't worth $100 unless they predate the mid 60's but newer models often sell for more. Good luck.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE: 1970's ? raleigh sports posted by marc on 1/5/2004 at 11:35:30 PM
did raleigh make cottered cranks into the late eighties? I thought those died off in the late 70's 80's.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††1970's ? raleigh sports posted by Dick in FL on 1/6/2004 at 12:42:53 AM
There are several impediments to this being a successful auction for you. The use of a reserve on an unremarkable bike has already been mentioned. In addition, you might consider elevating your photography standards. Also, there is such a thing as prepping a bike for sale ... or not. But I am really interested in learning how many negative feedbacks you would consider too many ... even damaging. I know that I risk giving offense with this inquiry, but you represent a valuable opportunity for the rest of us to understand the mindset of a seller/buyer who frequently disappoints.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††1970's ? raleigh sports posted by James on 1/6/2004 at 3:22:00 AM
I think the colour will limit the price, a nice black Sports complete with fenders, brooks saddle and old style lamp or dynohub can be a really beautiful classy bike that looks older than it is. Blue bikes just don't seem right, I think british bikes are like Model T Fords, "any shade of black."

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††1970's ? raleigh sports posted by marc on 1/6/2004 at 3:27:30 AM
Well, to be honest I do take some offense to your comments. First of all I do not claim to be an expert on bicycles, if I was I would certainly not have to come here and ask for the advice and opinions of the usually helpful people that participate on the message boards. Secondly, in concern to my feedback I admit that I do have some negative but I believe most of them if not all of them were given to me as a buyer and not a seller and most of which have an explanation. I am not proud of having negative feedback but I do. I haven't sold many bicycles on ebay but I have not had any complaints about the ones I have sold. Actually, I believe one person even stated that his bicycle arrived in exactly the condition I described it.
I'm not quite sure what offended you about my auction, you were not that clear on the matter. Do you have any problem with the content of my description? All I simply did was describe the condition of the bicycle I have in my posession.
This is a hobby of mine, I collect bicycles, admittedly mainly american bicycles and that is why I came here and asked questions. This is not my job and I cannot devote all of my time to the sale of bicycles. I apologize if you do not like the quality of my pictures but it is the best I can do with my HP photo smart digital camera. I took pictures of different parts of the bicycle, what else should I have done? Maybe I should have taken pictures in sunlight but I live in chicago and it is winter and the days are short this time of year and I usually work on my bicycles in the evening. Again this is my hobby and because of that I understand that part of the pleasure of purchasing a used/collectable bicycle is breaking it down part by part, cleaning it, poloshing it and putting it back together and marveling at the beauty of your new purchase and feeling satisfied that you took the time to restore it to its former glory. That is one of the reasons I do not "prep" most of the bicycles that I sell. But to be honest, I also do not have the time to "prep" all of them.
I put a reserve and a buy it now price at $150 because I was not exactly sure what this bike was worth. I am not forcing anyone to buy this bike, if it's not worth my reserve then it most likely won't sell at that price. All I was simply trying to do was protect myself. Is there anything deceitful about placing a reserve on an auction as you implied?
I eagerly await your response to this post and anyone elses' take on this situation.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††1970's ? raleigh sports posted by Stacey on 1/6/2004 at 3:50:32 AM
"Protect myself" from what Marc? STD's?... you only get them from screwing people. The kind of buyer a person is, IMHO is a fair indicator of what kind of seller that person will be. If someone can't deliver the cash on a deal, should they be expected to deliver the goods? It's a fools bet when 1 in 10 transactions results in someone getting boned.

Not everyone shares your enthuasium for resurecting bikes. Yeah, a $5 yard sale special can merit a strip down & service. But crikey! For $150 I and many others I'm sure, want a turn key rider.

Give me a shout when you get 8200 unique positives. Good luck!

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††1970's ? raleigh sports posted by Ed on 1/6/2004 at 3:57:54 AM
I see nothing wrong with your description of the bike. I also don't think the photos are all that bad either. I do think that your reserve and Buy it Now price are much too high for any Sports of that age and in less than nos condition,however this is just my opinion.
Good luck with this auction and with your Schwinn as well.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††1970's ? raleigh sports posted by marc on 1/6/2004 at 6:59:45 AM
Well Stacey I am trying to protect myself from selling this bike for too low of a price. Let us not be naive. When you go to a yard sale or a resale shop and find a bicycle priced at 5 dollars that you very well know is worth quite a bit more do you ever tell the seller what it's really worth? No, of course not. You hand the seller 5 dollars and then walk away with a big smile on your face. That is what I'm trying to protect myself from. Again, I said this from the begining, I HAD NO IDEA WHAT THIS BIKE WAS WORTH! And because of that I set a high reserve. In my original post I asked if this was a FAIR price not, "is this the most I can squeeze out of someone?" If it's not worth that price than it won't sell for that price. I'm not forcing anyone to bid on this bike.
Two months ago I paid around $200 for a schwinn panther and I loved every second of the cleaning, polishing, lubing, stripping, and painting I did on that bike. Yes it was in rough shape and yes I paid $200 for it. So I disagree with your opinion on needing a "turn key rider" for that price.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††1970's ? raleigh sports posted by Joe on 1/6/2004 at 7:02:23 AM
I don't really see anything wrong with your add, but I would say the reserve is a little optimistic. As far as age of the bike, by looking at the pics, I see it still has a Nottingham headbadge, a newer style reflector set, it still uses the black ribbed style Raleigh grips, A Heron Sprocket, and I don't see any pump pegs on the frame. The headbadge says it was still made in England, thus putting it at least back to the early 80's. The reflector set started around the late 1970's. It's was my understanding that somewhere in the early to mid 1980's when Raleigh of England broke up, the rights to the Raleigh brand here in the US went first to the Huffy Corporation, and after only a few years, to Derby of Kent, WA. Thus this bike definetly falls before that time period, however I do agree that it is not one of the more collectable editions of a Sports. These do still make good riders though.
I also noticed in your one pic the front fender brace is painted blue, is all of the paint original? I have several later Sports here, and they all have unpainted braces. Two other ways to date this bike is one, by the hub date code, and the other by the serial number.
As far as the comments above on your ebay history, I do see that the negatives were some time ago and your recent history, for the past two years,is very good. Be aware though, you can also respond to feedback comments on eBay, especially if there is a reasonable explaination to give. Myself, if I were looking to bid on an item, I would have to put the most weight on the fact that you have 77 positive responses as well.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE: 1970's ? raleigh sports posted by J M Vernooy on 1/6/2004 at 1:44:29 PM
Ten hours ago I was thinking that the price might be too high. But I certainly didn't think that you were trying to get too much for that bicycle. If anyone thinks a price is too high they don't bid. There will probably be another similar bicycle at a lower price offered at some later time unless the item is rare. If the price was too high for anyone it might even be offered again if no bids reached the reserve.

But look at the results still over three days from the end of the auction. The reserve has been met and the high bid as I write this is $100. The current high bidder, so says eBay, was the winning biddder of a Raleigh Sprint 5 speed last month. Has a Sports 3 speed without a Brooks leather B72 saddle gone to twice the value of a Sprint 5 speed with a Brooks leather B72 saddle? The color of this Sports may be working for it. It's not green.
I like to see a good English bicycle with a low price as much as anyone when buying. Auctions by their nature sometimes go too high and sometimes the result is too low.The seller does need to protect himself from too low a bid unless he's prepared to nearly give the bicycle away. But a price is really just a figment of the imagination. If the seller and the buyer have like imaginations then the item gets sold. If not it doesn't.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††1970's ? raleigh sports posted by Mark R. on 1/8/2004 at 2:55:54 AM
Marc, Obviously $100 isn't too much for the bike. Now-a-days $100 isn't even a lot of money for crying out loud. Personally, I would be a little skittish about the feedback, some says that you are a bum, but look, a lot of your feedback says you are an excellent eBayer. Go figgure.
The bike isn't as desireable as some but it IS worth about a buck and a quarter($125). Good luck with it, and work on that feedback bub. By the way, take a little time and prep the bikes a little. An hour could double the money you get on a bike.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††1970's ? raleigh sports posted by MR on 1/8/2004 at 2:45:42 PM
There ah, seems to be an occational out-burst of snotty rudeness out of some of the members here. Why is that? Is it because they are snotty rich bastards? The position of the moon ? What? I've seen this happen every so often for years here. I don't understand what there is about English bikes that make some of us occationally act like French people(by the way I'm French so don't take any more offense than I do). I love English bikes, but I'm beginning to wonder if I have made a bad choice. If I have to become some ugly american rich bastard to enjoy these damn bikes, maybe I'll go back to motorcycles! Have a little civility, even if you think bad about newbies/sellers.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††1970's ? raleigh sports posted by Stacey on 1/8/2004 at 11:31:10 PM
I gather that comment is directed at me, MR. Not rich, I work hard to pay what bills I can. Not a bastard, my folks were married when I was concieved. Not snotty, just an opinion. It just so happens that my opinion isn't popular. Tough! We as a board were asked for input, I gave mine. He didn't like it. Well, I guess he shouldn't have asked, right. Apparently you didn't like it either, well stick it up your frog arse, I wasn't talking to you.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††1970's ? raleigh sports posted by marc on 1/9/2004 at 7:39:18 AM
You're right, I didn't like what you said but you have every right to express your opinion just as I have the right to disagree with you and express my opinion. That's the beauty of these message boards, we get to discuss issues in the hobby and that's what we've done. I don't condone or support anything that anyone else said, I can only do that for my own responses. But I do have to say that your original post, at least to me, had a bit of a mean spirited tone. None the less, it's in the past and let us all move on before I regret creating this thread. Let's keep these discussions constructive.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE: 1970's ? raleigh sports posted by jack on 1/9/2004 at 7:44:27 AM
Wow, I'm away from the list for 2 weeks and I find spits and spats! Just remember, its difficult to properly express yourself in this medium and consequently its easy to misunderstand as well be misunderstood. Also, the USA has the highest rate of illiteracy among industrialized nations which doesn't help. IMO, anyone who collects AND rides bicycles is stem and bars above most people.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††1970's ? raleigh sports posted by Catfood Rob on 1/12/2004 at 7:42:49 PM
And as a final note, at the risk of not offending anyone...... ( ;0 )
Raleigh were still using cotter pins on high end bikes well into the 80`s.
I have a 1986 ladies racer with cotter pins. Raleigh thru and thru.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:†††Triumph Bicycle... Year??? posted by: Marcelo Afornali on 1/5/2004 at 9:51:40 PM

I am of Brazil, I have a page of old bicycles (www.bicicletasantigas.com.br) and look information on English a Triumph bicycle... The manufacture number is F57295... It would like to know the year of this bicycle if they will be able to help me... It would also like if possible, of the aid with some photo or catalogue, therefore the one that is in the gallery of this page, is not so clear... A catalogue would help very... The bicycle in question, is equal of the photo, also the measure of the wheels... Without more I thank and I wait aid...

A great one I hug and happinesses to the friends...

Marcelo Afornali...

AGE / VALUE:††† Workmen/ appliance repairmen in the lair, I hate it when it's necessary! posted by: Chris on 1/4/2004 at 9:43:39 PM
Tell me your tales! You have to allow somebody in the secret bike lair. They have to install a water heater or furnace, or something like that.

You never let anybody in there and here they are anyways all oggling and touching things and picking up things.
Tools vanish, the place smells of tobacco and strange folks have been there in your space. I hate it. They talked and asked annoying questions and thought I was nuts for all the bike stuff. They wanted a tip to boot!
I sit there pained and hoping that they'll hurry up. One guy went nuts and was so after me to sell tools and stuff.
Another guy wanted the wringer washer and would not shut up until my grandmother let him buy it! She got her arm caught up in the thing and warnbed him but he had to have it for his work clothes. The paintings, and furniture and all the goodies are all conversation starters and all I want him to do is to remember to put teflon tape on the threads!
I'm hesitant myself but one pal of mine was so relunctant, waited to have a gas leak repaired!
His collection was more vast than mine and he's older and it was difficult but we did get the guy in to get it fixed!
If it's over my head, I have to have them in to do whatever, but this is my private workspace, where the secret projects are.

Two repairmen in at once and I can't baby sit them both and then things vanish.

The American Standard shower head that I love, I almost lost that!
Tell me your repairman horror stories!

   RE:AGE / VALUE:††† Workmen/ appliance repairmen in the lair, I hate it when it's necessary! posted by Chris on 1/4/2004 at 9:56:49 PM
They came in and the one guy smelled of something really bad. Never had that stink in that house in 60 years. It was offensive and I questioned if he knew what he was doing!
If I was a cop it could have been interesting ... for him!

AGE / VALUE:†††I had no intention.... posted by: Ralph on 1/4/2004 at 3:12:00 AM
So this guy calls me out of the blue. I had talked to him a year or so about Raleigh Tourists. He saw me on mine, asked if I know how to fix the rod brakes. I give him my number "I'll call you when I want it fixed." I don't hear from him so I forget about it. Yesterday he calls. He tells me he's moving and wants to get rid of the Tourist. I need another Tourist like a hole in the head but I tell him I'll take a look. I'm intrigued by the wrap around chain guard he says it has. I'm thinking this thing might be pretty old. I get there with $100 in my pocket telling myself that if he wants more I'd be just as happy to pass on this thing.

As it turns out, it's a 1981 in fairly rough shape. No real rust, but a missing seat, bent seat stay, and broken rod on the front brake. I can fix all this crap, but there's no way I'm giving this guy any hundred dollars for this thing. I tell him "It's worth $40 to me." He doesn't even hesitate. "Fine. It's about what I was hoping for." I whip out the cash and he produces a new set of Fibrax shoes that he's throwing in. This wasn't a bad deal, but I already have a Tourist in imaculate condition, a Sports that looks like new, and a Hercules. This along with a Folder, Gran Prix, Super Course, Sprite, Record, BSA, Gran Sport, Colson Flyer, Tri Lite, Touring 14, Portage and about 10 other assorted bikes. I really needed another Tourist. I must be nuts, but I can't stop the madness!

I guess I just needed to vent to what's most likely the only group of people who might just be as nuts as I am. Thanks for listening to my rantings!

   RE:AGE / VALUE:†††I had no intention.... posted by Larry "Boneman" Bone on 1/4/2004 at 4:22:51 PM
>I guess I just needed to vent to what's most likely the only group of people who might just be as nuts as I am.

Nuts? Whadday mean, nuts? I don't understand at all. I see NOTHING amiss in your bahaviour whatsoever!

>Thanks for listening to my rantings!

Any Tourist is a good find! Yes, I have a pile of bikes too, but so what. Better that someone who appreciates them has them!

You wanna see nuts, you should have seen the looks I was getting on the NY State Thruway when I was returning from a "procurement journey" with no less than 11 English Bikes stuffed into the back of my Chevy S10 pickup truck!


Larry "Boneman" Bone

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††I had no intention.... posted by Chris on 1/4/2004 at 9:36:09 PM
For $40.00 you did just fine. You got a bargain!
These Raleigh's can get ahold of you just like he said.
Ride this one and keep the other one in immaculate condition.
These are rare these days.
What size frame? I never had a problem selling a 24 inch frame model to a pal of mine for $250.00. The voracious character could never get enough of these.
Yes, the basic D.L.1 Raleigh tourist, he still has a barn full of these.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††I had no intention.... posted by Ralph on 1/5/2004 at 3:51:37 PM
24" frame. The bent seat stay is fixed, Most of the rust is gone. I have to tap out a couple of dents. The biggest challange was the front brake linkage. I was thinking it looked about the same as a .105 gage spoke. Alas, the spoke was a hair small. But as it turns out, roadster fender stays are a perfect match. I happen to have a Hozan spoke threader with the correct die to thread the thing. I attached the new rod to the handlebar link with nuts on the top & bottom in kind of a compression fitting. Not real pretty, but you have to look close to see it, and the link works perfectly. Brakes repaired. The relpacement of the B-72 and frame pump will be childs play.

I'm real happy with the bike, and I'm glad that it'll live again. It would have been such a shame to have ended up with someone who would have parted it out, or worse... The curb.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:†††I had no intention.... posted by Larry "Boneman" Bone on 1/6/2004 at 12:28:19 AM
Another one rescued from an horrible fate!

Good on ya! Enjoy!


Larry "Boneman" Bone

FOR SALE:   Brit. Bike Parts CHEAP OR FREE this week only in PHILA posted by: Michael McGettigan/trophy bikes on 1/3/2004 at 10:25:20 PM
Greets -- Trophy Bikes (host of the Great Brit Bike Weekend in Philadelphia--8th annual set for this april 04) -- is moving... THEREFORE ...we can't bring everything and we're selling off lots of stuff from our basement.

Many Sturmey bits, many wheels, stacks of fenders and chainguards, frames, rims etc... much more and no, we have no list, no digital pics, no time, no plan...


If you are close to Philadelphia (trophy's old shop is at 311 Market St.) give us a call (mcget tel this week mon-fri only... 215.990.9275) and let us know when you'll be around and we will arrange to meet you.

After this week, it's all going to the local scrap guys...

do check our website www.trophybikes.com for more details on our new shop....
--cheers and thanks for reading...
Michael McGettigan/trophy bikes philadelphia