ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Palmer Bikes posted by: Tom on 10/9/2006 at 10:11:00 PM
Has anyone heard of the British bike maker Palmer. I tried looking on the net but nothing shows up. The bikes would have been pre 1960.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Palmer Bikes posted by Chris on 10/10/2006 at 9:55:26 AM
I have a set of Palmer bicycle tires. Whitewalls and they are 28 X 1 1/2 The symbol is a palm tree. Im never heard of a Palmer bicycle until now reading your post. Can you post a picture of the bike?

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Palmer Bikes posted by Tom on 10/10/2006 at 6:11:47 PM
I don't have a bike but I just heard of them. They were around until the 50's. I would like to find one of their bikes.

AGE / VALUE:   Phillips bicycle from Birmingham England posted by: Dana on 10/9/2006 at 6:00:20 PM
I have a Phillips bicycle made in England - Birmingham. I was going to get new wheels etc to ride - but the shop gasped saying -do you know what you have - do not touch this.

We saw the bike in a garage and for a couple years would go by asking, with the purpose of riding actually. The lady was wonderful. She was the original owner - rode it all over England, then shipped it to Korea, on to Alaska. In fact the little sticker from Alaska for the Purchasing of Alaska Celebration is still on it. She had the little metal gadget that held your pants to your leg to keep them out of the spoke, and a little package of tools that also came with it.

You can not ride as is - the thing is just old. So... how do I find out what this is worth?

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Phillips bicycle from Birmingham England posted by Chris on 10/10/2006 at 10:03:26 AM
After fitting new tires and tubes and making sure you replace the brake cables and gear shift cable. Go over the spokes to see that none are loose or missing. If the wheels are fairly true then you can ride it all over just like the former owner did. I ride mine all over.
If you hang onto the original parts you can upgrade and switch to differnet wheels, alloy handlebars, different brakes, whatever you wish.

Also, original headset races and bottombracket cups and pedal cranks are out there and available so this can be ridden for another 80 years plus.
Please describe the bike. What size wheels? cable or rod brakes? I take it this is a ladies frame? A lot of ladies prefer a mens frame version so I still ask. Is it complete? What color? any accessories like lights or a bell or a rack? skirt guards? How old is this?


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Phillips bicycle from Birmingham England posted by Matthew on 10/10/2006 at 10:25:38 AM
Hi Dana,

Get tyres on it and ride it. I have recently ridden hundreds of miles on a 1930's bike and I have friends with bikes dating back to the 1880's which get ridden regularly and over distances too. Bikes are built to be ridden, roadsters will last for several lifetimes. Bikes deteriorate faster when not ridden.

Matthew - pedal power.

'Get yourself a bike, you will not regret it.....If you live.' - Mark Twain

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Phillips bicycle from Birmingham England posted by Chris on 10/10/2006 at 10:29:04 AM
It is neat to discover and get ahold of an old bike like this and many of us have been there before.
It is common for a shop to advise you to keep it complete and this does preserve the value. Nothing knocks value down to nothing like a bike incomplete or missing parts.
A lot of people ride these bikes as is. I see them being driven on and on as is. The rear hubs have never been taken apart and cleaned or re- greased. Many are rarely ever oiled. Original bearings and cones are left in place and these bikes keep soldiering on. Headsets are never disassembled and re- greased they are just left to dry out and they still work these bikes wear like iron and 40 years after being assembled and never being maintained they are still rideable. It might not be smooth. But they go on and on. The rear Sturmey Archer hub that has not seen oil in years and years may have a dry "tick, click, tick" sound to it but it still functions. I can tell if your hub has not been oiled or re- greased by the sound of it. I see people ride these every day to and from work and the rims are hideously rusted and the gumwall tires have mutated into strangeness and still the dry fabric cord of the tires hold the air pressure and the bike rolls on. These bikes had thick brake cables and they still work even if not greased and cared for. I have seen folks ride the rear Sturmey- Archer hubs long after the gear teeth are stripped or crumble and the guy was riding it in third gear and the other two were not working and he was flying on this old Humber bike and I went after him and it was not easy to catch him and he was 72 years old at the time and after I did manage to buy the bike from him and they guys in the group got him onto a new modern bike after I got that rear Sturmey- Archer hub apart to examine it for wear I found metal bits and stripped teeth in the hub and he had put like 22,000 miles on that hub and it was still being ridden only in third until I got the bike from him and I re- built it with all new, original parts from the ground up and now I ride it myself.
The bearing cups in the headset and the bottom bracket axles and cups are hardened machined steel. The older a bike is, the better the parts are.
Phillips Cycles from Birmingham, England were a hugely popular, long standing, compettitor to Raleigh. They had Mojo and Muscle and were something awesome to behold in their day.
The best steel , longest wearing, hardest steel, bottombracket cups were made by BSA.

However, the folks in our group here know how to maintain the bikes and we re- build and restore and ride and so, just about any question you might have we can help and you'd be amazed what all we know.

So, ask.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Phillips bicycle from Birmingham England posted by Chris on 10/10/2006 at 11:00:58 AM
These bikes took lots of abuse and were solidly built. Another thing was the paint finishes that were applied over Spa- bonderized rust resistant finishes. A bike was bonderized or wore a decal that said Bonderite or Bonderized and what all this means is that 60 or 70 years after the bike was assembled and painted that the original finish is still quite good and the bikes frame is free of rust. Better rust prevention back long ago than today. Thicker steel in the wheel rims, better chrome plate, better paints, amazing paints, marvelous colors. I'll take these Old School bikes any day.

Don't think that just because this is old means that it should not be ridden. It should and can and I guarentee you that if you set this out at the kerb that it would dissapear and be picked up by somebody who would ride it.

I read where a past Raleigh bicycle director commented on the number of wealthy people who could afford a new bicycle but preferred the old ones. There is a large number of folks that are still riding 60 year old bikes that were hand me downs from uncle to father to son to grandson and due to the rake of the front fork and easy pedaling and gracefullness of the bike in general. The the way it handles and you just go gliding all over town on the thing and you are not tired afterwards- it speaks volumes about these bikes. Vintage bicycle trade magazines have write ups of 60 year old Mr. So and So of some foreign country that won the contest of the oldest bike and here he is recieving a new Raleigh as his prize after winning the contest and he is pictured with the old bike that he is commenting on: "IS STILL GOOD BIKE" he says.
So I say to keep it and ride it and enjoy it and you go ahead and be like all the others I meet. You look them in the eye and say "Not for sale!"


   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Phillips bicycle from Birmingham England posted by Chris on 10/10/2006 at 11:07:37 AM
The old tires some are 50 years old are still being ridden. I recommend that tires and brake cables be replaced if they are old but the old Dunlop War Grade tires on my B.S.A.Paratrooper bike from WW2 can be ridden and used still. Of course the collectors out there will tell you not to preserve these for history.

Marvelous tires. Thick treads, thick sidewalls. Things like this you save and retire for the display bike but everything else you ride and enjoy.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Phillips bicycle from Birmingham England posted by R. Bombara on 8/21/2007 at 7:35:02 PM
I have a Phillips bicycle given to me in 1970. It has been in my basement and when i took it to the shop to have it tuned up they refused to touch it saying it was a collector's dream. In good shape with all old original parts. How much could it be worth?

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Phillips bicycle from Birmingham England posted by R. Bombara on 8/21/2007 at 7:37:37 PM
I have a Phillips bicycle given to me in 1970. It has been in my basement and when i took it to the shop to have it tuned up they refused to touch it saying it was a collector's dream. In good shape with all old original parts. How much could it be worth?

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Phillips bicycle from Birmingham England posted by meg on 9/5/2007 at 4:12:44 PM
i have a phillips indian princess in awesome shape. my budy found i tin the dumpster. original forest green paint. female frame. the only problem is i can't shift it. i need a new cable and shifter- there's three speeds in an internal hub. my friend and i took the bolt off where the cable protrudes from the side of the tire and we tried to shift it into a lower gear by hand. could it be that the gear it was on before was the lowest? are these bikes jus tthat hard to ride? i can't find any info on the damn thing so i don't know what it's worth. if i could ride it in the city, i wouldn't sell it. any knowledge on the bike's history/advice about my gears would be greatly appreciated.

   RE:AGE / VALUE: Phillips bicycle from Birmingham England posted by Tim Evans on 9/30/2007 at 12:07:26 AM
Does anybody know the spec of the bottom bracket for a Phillips Vox Populi 531 gents touring bicycle?

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Phillips bicycle from Birmingham England posted by M on 4/3/2008 at 3:47:23 PM
How can you tell how old a Phillips bicycle is? I just acquired one-- I love it and ride it daily. Are there any markers that might tell me how old the bike is?

    Phillips bicycle [ Does anyone know which year is this bike? posted by Yuth on 6/21/2008 at 11:03:49 AM
I just mange to get one phillips bicycly and i have fun ridding it everyday "Think Earth" I just wonder which year is this bike produced? I've been searching the web to find similar kind of image, but unfortunately I can't


   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Phillips bicycle from Birmingham England posted by Yokohamamamas on 8/26/2008 at 1:56:55 PM
New to old roads and to forums so please forgive any lack of protocol. I have recently been given my father's Phillips bike (drop handlbars) which he dates back to the late 40s early 50s. He says it had a derralieur (excuse speeling) but I can't see where the shifters would have gone? He replaced this with the Sturmey Archer 3 speed which is still on it. I am really just looking for any advice on how to discover the model and the original set-up, where to get a derralieur and any general advice on how to restore it, clean the frame etc. Also, I have become very interested in Phillips but there seems to be a real lack of information on them (especially in the UK where they appear to be looked down upon a little), any info much appreciated.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules All Chrome Auction posted by: Bryan on 10/9/2006 at 2:16:09 PM
Not my auction, no relation to seller etc:



   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS: Hercules All Chrome Auction posted by Warren on 10/10/2006 at 4:11:08 AM
All chrome but half rust...

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules All Chrome Auction posted by Matthew on 10/10/2006 at 10:20:34 AM
Not good condition either and I doubt its a '55.

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Hercules All Chrome Auction posted by Chris on 10/11/2006 at 2:54:31 PM
The pedal cranks cannot be original. Aweful replacement cranks at least the left hand crank arm anyways.

MISC:   FRAME SIZE posted by: Mark on 10/9/2006 at 10:48:18 AM
Sorry to bother y'all with another frame size question. I have two. 1. What is the standover height of the smallest gents frame of a DL-1 and what was that frame size and the seat tube angle? I noticed in the '76 catalog that there was a silver gents Sports offered in the 19.5 inch size. 2. How far back was the 19.5 size offered in a Sport and what the seat tuble angle on those? This will help me decide which bike to start looking for. I once had a Sprite in the 21 inch size and it was a little tall for me but it was usable in rural riding which I do mostly anyway.

   RE:MISC: FRAME SIZE posted by Mark Stonich on 10/9/2006 at 7:00:41 PM
The smallest DL-1 is somewhat taller than a 21" Sports.

Smaller frames, though rare must go back quite a way. Last summer I accidently bought a 19.5" 1958 Robin Hood. At that time I didn't know they had made them that small, so I assumed it was a 21".

I gave it to a shorter friend who added V-Brake braze-ons so he could run 559 rims instead of the stock 590s. He also installed 160mm Bulletproof cranks which not only work well for him but also avoid loss of ground clearance due to smaller wheels.


   RE:MISC:   FRAME SIZE posted by Matthew on 10/10/2006 at 10:28:25 AM
Hi Marks one & all,

19" frames were considered 'boys' frames pre-WW2. I've certainly seen several pre-war 19" framed roadsters.

Matthew - minature in motiion.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Lights for Raleigh Sports posted by: ThomJ. on 10/9/2006 at 9:46:01 AM
I would like to add lighting to my 1974 Raleigh Sports and keep it as close to "period correct" as possible rather than use one of the current L.E.D. types of lights I see in most bike shops. My questions/concerns to the group is what type of add-on lighting was offered at this time? Bottle generator lights or battery powered? I'm not real keen on re-building the front wheel to use a hub generator since the bike didn't come with it. I may still use a rear "blinky" as an additional safety precaution. As a side note, I've really begun to enjoy riding the old Raleigh. It's great fun to just get on it and take a ride anywhere I would like without having to "suit-up" to ride the go-fast road bike; although there are times when that's fun too. Thx in advance for all your help. Thom.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Lights for Raleigh Sports posted by Mark on 10/9/2006 at 10:47:37 AM
I remember cheap bottle generators and battery lights sold by Cycle Products or some other simialr name back in the early-mid seventies. I saw lots of them at places like Sears, Target and Western Auto. The ones I had would rust as I was riding along because the plating was so thin. I'm thinking of adding one when I get another Raleigh myself. I agree with you, new bikes just don't have the allure of old British bikes.

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Lights for Raleigh Sports posted by David on 10/9/2006 at 4:13:23 PM
Take the plunge and build or get a front wheel with a Dynohub. I think you can get Sun rims w/32 holes (the commonest Dyno type) from Harris and you'd improve your brakes at the same time. The bottle generators have a LOT of drag and the Dyno has none. I use Busch & Muller halogen lamp with it. Peter White has them with the switch you'll need. Replacement bulbs from Reflectalite.com. You'll be very happy you did it.