WANTED:   Parts for my '51 Raleigh Sports "C" Tourist posted by: Kurt K. on 4/12/2006 at 1:04:11 AM
Well, since you fellows want action here on the forum, I'll provide some...with my list of parts needed to complete my '51 Sports "C" Tourist project.

Dull, yes, but I have little else to report on.

*NOS aluminum Raleigh heron headbadge
*1950's Raleigh Heron crankset (has Reg. Patent number near spindle hole)
*1950's Raleigh handlebar and stem in near mint to mint condition (stem should have Reg. Patent number on top w/Raleigh Industries stamped on the post section)
*1950's Raleigh brake levers
*Rear brake cable with soldered end, preferably non-ribbed silver housing cable by Clarks Of England
*One pair of narrow '50s Raleigh brake holders (the kind that fit the narrow Fibrax pads. I swear I have two pairs here, and they've disappeared).
*Union, Raleigh or English-made chain

The below are not necessary at this time, but I'll need them soon enough:

*Black enamel Raleigh pump
*Black enamel Raleigh headlamp w/taillamp
*Brooks B.66 saddle or just the leather top from a B.66 minus the saddle frame.

P.S.: Still looking for that Coffee rear fender for my '74 Sports...

Got any of this? Email me at cudak888@aol.com.

Take care,


   RE:WANTED:   Parts for my '51 Raleigh Sports posted by Bryan on 4/12/2006 at 10:12:19 PM
I see you mention the leather top to a Brooks saddle. I've often wondered about this. Is is possible to replace the leather tops to Brooks saddles? How?

   RE:WANTED:   Parts for my '51 Raleigh Sports posted by Matthew on 4/13/2006 at 8:40:54 AM
Hi Kurt,

Sorry I have none of the items listed so can't help directly with your requests. The 'English made chain' would be Reynolds if you can get it. Cycle shops used to stock it by the yard and you purchased as much as you needed.

Bryan, If you can get a new top or a peice of leather to replace an old top then you would need bifurcated copper rivets to replace the rivets you would remove to get the old one off. I guess a good sadler (not a 'saddlery' ie horse chandlery) or maybe a Harley custom shop might be able to cut you a new saddle top with the right holes in it. They can probably provide the rivets too.

Matthew - all spare parts, some working.

   RE:RE:WANTED:   Parts for my '51 Raleigh Sports posted by Larry "Boneman" Bone on 4/13/2006 at 9:38:06 AM
To Matthew's point... these folks do beautiful stuff:


They're real nice folks too. If anyone could make a new saddle top, I bet they could. Could very well be that all you would need to do is send them the olde one?


Larry "Boneman" Bone

   RE:RE:RE:WANTED:   Parts for my '51 Raleigh Sports posted by Kurt K. on 4/13/2006 at 5:16:01 PM
Yes, it's possible to replace the top on a Brooks, but by choice, the replacement top should be in pretty good shape with the metal nose installed.

Installation is relatively easy - simply knock out the six rear rivets holing the bad top to the existing frame, then re-rivet the new top on, with the nose loose.

I use steel rivets from Ace Hardware - they're a pretty decent substitute to the originals. I don't have the tool to smash the ends with (I refuse to use blind rivets for this process - doesn't look good), so I usually place the saddle upside down on a slab of aluminum (with a few rags in between), split the end of the rivet with a punch, then flatten them down with a hammer and an old bolt against the rivet end.

Last, and hardest step is to stretch the nose over the tension pin. This requires, commonly, a few failed attemps with a pair of narrow screwdrivers to push the frame back and down about 1/4 inch to slide it onto the nose - these Brooks saddles are streched tight!

Here's an example:

I recently bought a near-NOS 1980's Brooks B.72 top on eBay (the original frame, according to the seller, fractured) to replace that of one of my '70s B.72s that began to sag on the seatpost after the leather tore at the nose.

Here's the finished product:


Not bad, if I do say so myself.

I would have used this B.72 top on my current B.66 saddle, but besides the fact that the B.66 doesn't have the saddle bag holes through the leather, it turns out that the B.66 also has a different rear rivet pattern to clear the springs.

Matthew, I'll keep a look out for that Reynolds chain.

Did they make it in 531? ;-)

Take care,


   RE:WANTED:   Parts for my '51 Raleigh Sports posted by Matthew on 4/13/2006 at 9:36:21 PM
No that's a little early Kurt, they probably made it in 1931! :-]

Matthew - historical.

   RE:RE:WANTED:   Parts for my '51 Raleigh Sports posted by Bryan on 4/13/2006 at 9:54:56 PM
From those pics, Kurt, I would be hard pressed to tell your work from the original. Well done!

   RE:RE:RE:WANTED:   Parts for my '51 Raleigh Sports posted by Kurt K. on 4/13/2006 at 10:36:06 PM
Matthew: Haha, no, no! I meant Reynolds 531 steel! I'll probably just try to hunt down some NOS Union chain. Heck, it'll be hidden in the chaincase, who's going to know the difference?


It did come out nice, yes, but I never thought it to be that close to the original, for I do notice the difference between the original rough rivets and my domed replacements.

Oh well, that's the perfectionist in me...


   RE:WANTED:   Parts for my '51 Raleigh Sports posted by David on 4/13/2006 at 11:24:18 PM
The English chain is "Renold," no relation to Reynolds tubing. They're still in business, but I don't know if bicycle chain is part of it anymore. ("Union" parts are German.)

   RE:WANTED:   Parts for my '51 Raleigh Sports posted by Jeff on 4/14/2006 at 1:35:07 AM
So Kurt, you're the guy who outbid me on the B-72 skin. I'm glad it worked so well. I had the same plan, right down to the same rivets. Your rivet setting method is the one that works for me. I still have a B-72 frame that needs new leather. I'll keep looking on ebay. I must say I was a little skeptical of that guy who said he had two B-72s with broken frames though!

   RE:RE:WANTED:   Parts for my '51 Raleigh Sports posted by Kurt K. on 4/14/2006 at 1:52:31 AM
David: Renold it is then. Will keep an eye out for some.

Jeff: Well, I'm sorry there couldn't have been two skins and two high bidders.

Glad to hear that I'm not the only one that repairs B.72s in this manner.

Oh, it's very possible for a rider to have two B.72s with broken frames...it depends on the rider, and what type of riding he does. I can imagine a heavy-set mountainbiker (not that he is, this is just an example - don't know the specifics) could conceivably crack one of these B.72 coil-spring frames.

Alternatively, he might have picked up each one seperately on the cheap, with the same idea of re-covering another frame with the spare tops.

Take care,



   RE:WANTED:   Parts for my '51 Raleigh Sports posted by Matthew on 4/14/2006 at 12:11:23 PM
Hi David, Kurt, Brian, et al,

I got the 531 one joke Kurt! It was me being silly imagining some dark aged blacksmith perfecting the chain and waiting 1400 yrs for the bicycle to be invented.

David - thanks for the reminder of course its Renolds not Reynolds my memory is shocking... what was I saying?

Broken saddle frames and come to that broken frames etc all are dependent on stress fractures. You know if you keep bending a piece of wire back and forth for long enough it will snap? Well, seat frames and bike frames are just the same, even individual pieces of frames are under stress at different times. Riding conditions, speed, weight, temperature etc all lead to stress fractures. Imagine a French rider pedalling along on pave' (can't do accents). the constant jarring over the surface will produce fractures. On MTBs its often head stocks that fail, watch video of how they ride and this becomes easily apparent (is that an oxi-moron?). I have seen handlebars snap of at the stem, leaving a rider one handed, for exactly the same reason a stress fracture. Often these fractures are progressive. When a component finally fails you will see corrosion or ageing of the frascture surface. If there has been movement of the fracture before failure it may appear to have a 'polished' face. The final fracture will be rapid and fresh showing the crystaline make up of the metal. Some times the fracture will show lines of stress around the fracture (almost like tree rings). High carbon and heat treated steels are even more prone to failure. If you don't believe this go to a haulage yard or scrap yard and see if you can see any leaf road springs that have failed, they nearly always break straight across at a point where they meet another leaf, have a hole drilled through them or are held in a clamp, all of which are areas of high stress. Saddle frames snapping - more common than you might think, even on roadsters.

Matthew - those physics lectures paid off!

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   AG posted by: nat on 4/11/2006 at 11:59:05 PM
1961 AG hub shell's lustreous copper patina - chrome off


   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   AG posted by nat on 4/12/2006 at 12:02:49 AM
de-burring spoke holes


   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   AG posted by nat on 4/12/2006 at 12:04:51 AM
AG bits - (except for ...)


   RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   AG posted by nat on 4/12/2006 at 12:07:58 AM
Is there a heavier hub? - this one's 4lbs


   RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   AG posted by Larry "Boneman" Bone on 4/12/2006 at 12:44:13 AM
Dunno 'bout heavier... but I'm thinking IMHO that's one of the prettiest one's around!


Larry "Boneman" Bone

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   AG posted by Kurt K. on 4/12/2006 at 1:00:38 AM
Pretty sure the FG 4-speed Dynohub weighs a tad more at about 4.5/5 pounds or so.


   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   AG posted by David on 4/13/2006 at 11:25:44 PM
Is steel first copper plated before chrome plating?

   RE:RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS: AG posted by sam on 4/14/2006 at 1:56:06 AM
yes if done right.

AGE / VALUE:   Anybody there? posted by: Matthew on 4/11/2006 at 9:40:07 PM
Larry, Kurt, Chris, PC, are you there?
I'm concerned that you've all been abducted by intelligent alien life trying to gain knowledge of the ancient craft of three speed cycling. Am I now alone?

Matthew - .......................

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Anybody there? posted by Larry "Boneman" Bone on 4/12/2006 at 12:41:46 AM
LOL... I'm here... just not all there... er... here... all that often.

SPRING has sprung! So... been actually quite busy. Got out for a nice 3.5 mile cruise this evening. Yes... the bikes have all been hibernating.

So... whilst the LEGS are rubbery.... it was my first time out since I quit SMOKING... and it's quite a bit of difference for sure!

Thanks for the concern, sir! Hopefully, all the other regular denizens of this venue are out and about and will be checking back shortly!


Larry "Boneman" Bone

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Anybody there? posted by Kurt K. on 4/12/2006 at 12:58:20 AM
I'm still here, clonking along as always.

I would report on the progress of my '51 Sports "C" Tourist now, but there's nothing to report.

I haven't found this forum to be particularly responsive to my Wanted posts for parts (but you'll be getting one in 15 minutes), so I've pretty much whiled away my time trading parts back-and-forth with fellow forum member Neal Lerner.

Standby for a big 'ol Wanted post...


   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Anybody there? posted by Chris on 4/12/2006 at 1:09:40 AM
I read the roadsters section every day. Still with you. Always will be.


   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Anybody there? posted by Kurt K. on 4/12/2006 at 1:22:41 AM
Glad to hear you're here, Chris. Your presence is an honor, both as a collector...and a fine writer!


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Anybody there? posted by Matthew on 4/12/2006 at 9:52:07 PM
That just leaves our friend and veritable fount of knowledge, P.C. Kolher. Are you out there? A hate to think we have lost touch, caused offence or worse. You Sir are a vital part of what makes this forum work so well. None of us are stand alone experts but together we are strong and, like the British Library, full of knowledge.

Matthew - just checking the flock (its a pastoral thing)

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Anybody there? posted by Bryan on 4/12/2006 at 10:14:26 PM
...though I would nominate PC as a stand alone expert on this topic if there ever was one!! At least when it comes to club cycles.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Anybody there? posted by Chris on 4/13/2006 at 2:36:36 PM
P.C. Kohler is my mentor. He's done fine work.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Anybody there? posted by P.C. Kohler on 4/15/2006 at 2:34:38 AM
A bobby on a Raleigh policeman's Dl-1 shined his torch through my window recently indicating you chaps were wondering what I was up to?

Well his torch illuminated the same one-bedroom flat filled with bikes, still mostly British but.. shock! horror! now lots of primo racing bikes like 1975 and 1980 Raleigh Team Pros, a 1971 Harry Quinn and yes.. yes a 1969 and a 1981 Peugeot and a 1973 Cinelli. So I have strayed a bit off course. But still have and ride my 1948 RRA. And looking for a worthy new home for my 1948, 1949 and 1951 Clubmans as they are simply too small at 22" for me to comfortably ride. The Dl-1 and Rudge Super Safety stay!

And still enjoying this site and contributing when I have some useful to add.

So thanks for the interest. And that policeman's roadster is way cool... they had specially strengthened bottom brackets and chainrings for... well let's face it not all bobbys are lithe and skinny! I also think these were the last DL-1 frames that came in a 26" frame size???

P.C. Kohler, found safe and sound

   value of bike? posted by Laura on 4/28/2006 at 7:17:13 PM
I have an 1971 Sears and Roebuck black 3 speed bike. The added attachments are a generator w/ headlight. Rear steel duel baskets and rear view mirror. This bike as all original and only ridden a few times then put inside a storage. There are no scrapes
on the bike seat.

MISC:   Paint and Decals - 1957 Raleigh Sports posted by: Brian Collins on 4/10/2006 at 7:46:08 PM
Hello all,

I'd appreciate some help. I have an all original 1957 Raleigh Sports 3 speed with front dynohub. It's black, with fully enclosed chainguard and front dynohub.

Any idea on the type of paint that was used to originally paint the bike?

Any ideas on where to get a set of replacement decals?

Any help would be appreciated.

Ride on,

   RE:MISC:   Paint and Decals - 1957 Raleigh Sports posted by Matthew on 4/10/2006 at 9:27:26 PM

You can get good results with brush on enamel paint, Blackfriars is a good brand. Finnigans Smooth finish Hammerite will also do well for a repaint but is too thick for touch up. You can find variable quality finish on Raleighs usually dependent on age. An austerity model I restored had hardly any paint on it to start with and seemed to have been painted on bare steel. Later models faired a lot better but some late 70's and 80's models appeared to have only a brief encounter with paint.

Matthew - a brush with history.

ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Sticker advice please posted by: Jess Leber on 4/9/2006 at 2:37:04 PM
I would really appreciate any help with a question regarding replacement stickers for my 1969 Raleigh Sports. I purchased a (nearly) full set of replacement stickers off of eBay (you may have noticed the guy from Bangkok who seems to have a stash of them) to help finish off my bike project. With the help of a truly gifted bike mechanic (I swear, he rode my bike down the block and said "there's a missing pawl spring in your rear hub", and damn if he wasn't correct) this bike has been almost fully restored. SO, 3 quick questions, plese:
1) Do you think it's even worth it to replace some of the old or missing stickers, or is their condition a proud badge of age?
2) Any recommendations for removing some of the ratty ones? I really don't want to hurt the paint, which is overall still very good.
3) I have never dealt with stickers like this before (they are all on one sheet, with a protective piece of waxy cardboard-y like paper backing) and I'm not sure how to apply them.

Many thanks in advance,

by the way: I'll likely have some extra stickers left over at the end of this, if I can be of help to anyone

   RE:ENGLISH ROADSTERS:   Sticker advice please posted by Matthew on 4/9/2006 at 5:01:18 PM
Hi Jess,

My thoughts, for what they are worth.

1) Do you think it's even worth it to replace some of the old or missing stickers, or is their condition a proud badge of age?
The originals are the best but any missing or very damaged examples could well be replaced.

2) Any recommendations for removing some of the ratty ones? I really don't want to hurt the paint, which is overall still very good.
Use your fingernail, some thinners, or a little warm air to get them off.

3) I have never dealt with stickers like this before (they are all on one sheet, with a protective piece of waxy cardboard-y like paper backing) and I'm not sure how to apply them.
Are they stickers or water slide transfers? Stickers will peel easily from the backing and can be applied onto the paintwork, which can be covered with liberal quantities of soapy water first to allow movement of the sticker when first applied. Use a squeegy to get the soapy water out from under the sticker when it is in exactly the correct position. However water slide transfers or decals will need immersing in water to get them to leave the backing sheet and then are applied carefully and wet being dabbed dry when in position. You can cut each decal and a section of backing separate from the main sheet to save you soaking them all at once.

Remember these are just my thoughts.

Matthew - applying myself.