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Archived: Vintage Lightweights

VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Peugeot alert! posted by: Keith on 9/8/2000 at 7:26:37 AM
I'ts a PX-? has %#! frame, but might bot be full db. Owner first thought it was UO-8, then maybe PX-10. Might be some unfamiliar model in between. It looks clean - leather Ideal saddle looks new! About a day left, only bid to about $130. Not mine. # 427 451 602

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Peugeot alert! posted by Oscar on 9/8/2000 at 7:47:18 AM
Watch your potty mouth, Keith. Oh, %#! means 531.

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Peugeot alert! posted by Tom Adams on 9/8/2000 at 8:25:16 AM
The parts do look like their great shape, and Ideal saddles have been going for a bunch. However I'm pretty sure the frame is not full 531 double butted. The decal is wrong as well as being partially illegible, and the rear triangle is painted instead of being half chromed as is normal on the full 531 bikes. Still, not a bad economy Peugeot. Vive le France! If the cranks were 175 I'd bid myself.

Tom Adams

AGE / VALUE:   This should never happen to a nice French bike like this posted by: ChristopherRobin on 9/7/2000 at 4:36:29 PM
The little bicycle had given up all hope, and was really sad as the garbage truck loomed ominously closer. After all the years of service to be ignored in the garage and then suddenly being put at the kerb with no notice. Where was my rider it wondered, who is this taking me to the kerb? Where are we going? The men were jumping down off the runningboards to snatch up bags,boxes, and anything in reach.I noticed out of the corner of my eye that there was a bicycle and I pulled over and jumped out and for a second I shook my head in disbeief and cried out to myself "Oh my, It's a Louison Bobbet, with racks and lights!" and what a beautiful bicycle this is! I leaned over and picked it up and put it in the trunk. Now everything was going to be alright now,and the bike heaved a sigh of relief as we passed the big, smelly, old terrible trash truck.You see, I called a friend and got the story on Louison Bobbet, and described it in detail for him and I have overhauled hubs and cleaned and polished, and replaced tires and tubes, and overhauled the headset and bottom bracket and I will go hunting for new light lenses. I took it for a spin around the neighborhood and then back in the garage. I leaned the shiny prize up against a wall and went to bed. The gratefull bike did not mind that I switched seats and it looks great, plus it is happy in the garage with all the other bikes.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   This should never happen to a nice French bike like this posted by Brian L. on 9/7/2000 at 6:09:01 PM
Too cool. Just a small point, is it Bobet with one "b" or Bobbet, like John Wayne? I've seen an early 60's vintage Bobet that actually had early Suntour dropouts. That one was fairly crude, but had a great head badge. Tell us more about yours, and what it was outfitted with (its sounds as though it was more or less original).

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   This should never happen to a nice French bike like this posted by Oscar on 9/7/2000 at 8:37:17 PM
Speaking of coincidences. Gabe Konrad sent out postcards to former "On the Wheel" subcribers for a new book on classic bikes. On the picture side of the post card is a tinted photo of...Louison Bobbet! It came in today's mail, probably at the very time Mr. Robin was performing a gallant rescue.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   This should never happen to a nice French bike like this posted by Keith on 9/8/2000 at 6:30:41 AM
Eugene Sloane's original 1970 "Complete Book of Bicycling" features this brand prominently, though I think I've only ever seen one of them myself. Good rescue!

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   This should never happen to a nice French bike like this posted by Keith on 9/8/2000 at 6:49:09 AM
Loison was a TDF winner a long time ago? Right?

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   This should never happen to a nice French bike like this posted by Oscar on 9/8/2000 at 7:42:48 AM
Louison Bobet (one b, I've learned)won the T de F in '53, '54, and '55. Three years in a row. Hey, that's a goal for Lance for the next Tour!

   Why can't I spell? posted by ChristopherRobin on 9/11/2000 at 10:21:34 AM
Bobet has one b and one t. The bike's badge says L.Bobet on the front with the mans picture Louison Bobet in foil on the down tube.

   RE:Why can't I spell? posted by Christopherrobin on 9/13/2000 at 4:09:51 PM
This has 26 X 1 3\8 wheels and was made that way. It only will take a 26. derailur rear wheel.

VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Miyata posted by: Keith on 9/7/2000 at 9:26:24 AM
Go to www.miyatausa.com. Look at the history section. Started in 1898. They made the touring Univegas. Not a high-tech fly-by-night newbie. Then go look at the Miyata Road Gentleman (the only model imported in 60cm). Lugged, triple-butted splined chromoly. Full brazeons. I've said it before -- my wife's early 80s Miyata Pro would embarrass a lot of European frames -- perfect mitering, brazing, and cutouts. Top notch. Would this turn heads like a Rivendell Heron or Waterford? Of course not! Would it ride as well as one? It might -- dunno unless I try 'em both for a few 100s of miles, which is impractical to expect. Price: $275 new. That's not a typo. I've made a number of rash decisions on bikes in the past -- not this time. I'm just considering all of my options before I sign on the dotted line. Anyway, if any of you are going full-blown touring, and want lugged steel -- check these out. Along the same lines, go to the Mercian website. These guys are living in the 70s. 531 lugged steel frames -- even the same models as in the 70s. Still hearth brazed. A real throwback company.

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Miyata posted by Art on 9/7/2000 at 3:03:42 PM
It's interesting watching you play out your bike buying process publicly. You mention the fact that the Miyata wouldn't turn heads as much as a Rivendell or Heron. It's been talked about on the site before, maybe in English roadsters, that more often than not people, even so-called serious bicyclists don't even notice the true beauty and style of a bike that many of us on this site value. They value the flash. I didn't realixe it at the time I posted it, but what I was thinking about the Allegro was making it invisible...most pople won't even see the lugwork or the classic lines of the bike. So my response sort of was to go in the opposite direction....no color, no flash...just the bike. I think someone mentioned in passing the idea of messenger bikes. I love going to San Fransisco because what I see are bikes that on first glance are bikes that look like junk...spray painted, plastered with decals, looking really trashy, but on further inspection I'm looking at a stripped down Paramount or Bianchi or something old, interesting and classic. But most poeple don't see it. They're invisible. I watched the movie "Quicksilver" with Kevin Bacon as a bike messenger...It's not a particularly great movie, but he rides a stripped down silver road bike(I can't tell what it is) not even handlebar tape. I like this bike, not because I don't like full out classic bikes...I do love them, but I like it
because it's just the bike, nothing more.

   stealth bikes posted by John E on 9/7/2000 at 7:34:23 PM
I like my Capo because its ugly dull red Rustoleum paint job is partial theft insurance. The bike is far better than it looks, making it the perfect beater. In contrast, I won't leave the Schwinn mountain bike, with its flashy "steal me" Paramount red-white-and-blue Imron factory paint job, anywhere unattended.

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Miyata posted by Brian L. on 9/8/2000 at 12:36:01 AM
What about one of the Gazelles from renaissance-cycles.com? Perhaps mated up to that beautiful chrome fork with the Zeus crown? I think that you could have the pair (which would mean a groovy extra fork) with shipping for around $400?

On a completely different topic, we are getting a foretaste of nasty winter rain and wind tonight which bums me out. Death riding for cyclists in the City. The real problem with all of my rain bikes is that none of them have canti's and I can barely cram the big tires in between the pads and under the fender. Got me thinking of setting my cross bike back up for urban assult but it's perfectly set up now with flat bars and great knobbies ...

Maybe I'll just weanie out and drive when its really ugly.

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Miyata posted by Keith on 9/8/2000 at 6:44:31 AM
City bikes and messenger bikes -- cool subjects. My recently-built one-speed Schwinn Voyager is very much like the typical messenger bike I see, but without the bullhorn bars they seem to favor. The simplicity of these bikes is itself stunning. My Voyager is pretty beat up. With the usual clunky old Suntour stuff it would look pretty sad, I think. But I got out my parts box, and put those graceful mid-80s Shimano 600 sidepulls on it, with aero levers, some nice wheels (lf Miche hubs/Nisi rims), generic but okay SA cranks, black Suntour Superbe pedels, and a sleek, swoopy profile, old Unica Superlegara saddle. I'm not doing it justice, but despite the ratty paint (or because of?), with the bright chrome forks, stays, and crown, the cool parts, and the stripped down simplicity, it is a beautiful bike. I rode it on a 25 mile club ride last weekend, and beat the pants off another guy in an end-of-the-ride sprint. Life is good.

   rain bikes posted by John E on 9/8/2000 at 7:06:40 AM
Inclement weather -- yet another argument in favor of old road touring bikes. My Capo has enough frame clearance for 27 x 1-1/4" tyres and full fenders, and its Weinmann centerpull / KoolStop braking system is adequate, as long as I lightly drag the brakes to dry the rims.

VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   There is a difference posted by: Keith on 9/6/2000 at 1:09:16 PM
One more observation. After a few weeks of riding basically only my Schwinn LeTour commuter, and then riding my Paramount on the same route today, I rediscovered that the notion of "ride quality" is not just some esoteric b.s. There is a difference, and it's dramatic. Not that the LeTour is a terrible bike -- just not nearly as good. I need to relegate it to rainy muddy days.

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   There is a difference posted by tim on 9/6/2000 at 1:25:08 PM
just bought a paganini road bike circa l980-l985. Columbus tubing, sew-ups, all braze ons, seems to be a decent bike. I can find no info on it whatsoever. Ever hear of it, or can you recommend a source of info that could help identify it? Hope you don't mind me e-mailing you.

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   There is a difference posted by Keith on 9/7/2000 at 7:37:18 AM
Never heard the name, except for the famous violinist. It makes me wonder, did every family in Italy make frames at one time or another? Sounds like the Brits -- lots of working class metal workers and such building frames at home, some going on to establish great reputations, etc. Anyway, I haven't a clue.

VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   What works best for you? posted by: Keith on 9/6/2000 at 7:27:50 AM
I rode my Paramount to work today. I couldn't help noticing how much better the Campy Nouvo Record worked for me than the Suntour 3000 stuff on my regular commuter (I keep the chain and everything clean and well-lubed on both bikes, and nothing on either is unduly worn). I know that flies in the face of what many seem to express -- that the Suntour slant parallelogram actually works better. The NR on the Paramount handles the 5-speed 14-28 flawlessly. It is the quickest, smoothest, most positive, and quietest drive train I have. And I don't think this is purely subjective. What's your experience?

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   What works best for you? posted by Eric Amlie on 9/6/2000 at 10:34:12 AM
This is interesting. I am in the process of replacing as many of the Simplex components on my '71 Gitane Tour de France as I can with period Campy. I just recently got the Nouvo Record rear derailleur mounted. Sutherlands claims that the largest cog the NR will handle is a 26 tooth, but I have an old article from from the '70s by Frank Berto which says it can handle up to a 30 tooth. So... I'm testing. I mounted a 14-28 cluster and did some preliminary adjusting. The NR will definitely shift up on to the 28 but is not completely quiet there. I was thinking that this was because it was out of its design range but you have given me hope. I will try more adjusting to see if I can quiet it down. 14-28 5 speeds are a lot easier to find than 13 or 14-26 5 speeds. I'm an old fat guy and I like those lower gears. By the way, the old Simplex derailleurs shifted beautifully. I hesitated to monkey with things but this is an excercise in vanity.

   RE:RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   What works best for you? posted by Keith on 9/6/2000 at 11:14:00 AM
Yes, I'm familiar with the 26t limit for the NR, but 28 will work, and work quite well. I've found that two things seem to make a difference: First, you gotta make sure you have enough chain so that it will wrap over the 28 in the back and 52 in the front, but not TOO much, so that the cage can still just take up the slack when it's in 42 x 14. Second, the dropout adjusters have to be set just so -- experiment with yours, but I found that quiet running and reliable shifting was achieved only by having the axle far back in the dropouts -- as in almost as far back as they'll go without removing the springs. Good luck! And I'm with you on the gear range. As a kid I wouldn't have been caught dead with anything bigger than a 21 in the back, and I could make it go up some serious hills. Now, 50 pounds and 25 years later, lower gears is more better.

   RE:RE:RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   What works best for you? posted by Oscar on 9/6/2000 at 12:52:47 PM
I used to think that 14-28 was nerd-style because all production 10-speeds used that range. But it works out great for riding in all different circumstances. My fav. bike uses a 5 speed Shimano 14-28. $20.

   battle of the derailleurs posted by John E on 9/6/2000 at 5:23:47 PM
My bike transmissions:
Bianchi: Campy NR with friction downtube levers; 13-26 Sachs 7-speed; 50-42 chainrings
Peugeot: SunTour cyclone rear, Shimano 600 front, SunTour friction downtube levers; 14-26 SunTour 5-speed; 49-46-43 rings
Capo: SunTour V rear, Cyclone front, Campy friction downtube levers; 14-28 Shimano 6-speed; 52-42 rings
Schwinn mountain bike: SunTour 6000 rear, 7000 front, thumb levers (in friction mode); 13-26 SunTour 7-speed; 48-40-24 rings

My observations and opinions after many miles:
Although the Campy shift levers and front derailleur are far better than their Japanese counterparts, I agree with Frank Berto that all three SunTour rears outshift the Campy. However, most cyclists learn to compensate subconsciously for the Campy's late shifting by overshifting and backing off, and its smoothness and consistency are impressive. Keith is right-on with his suggestions regarding wheel placement and chain length.
By the way, I like my "8-tooth-drop in front / 2-tooth average progression in back" gearing pattern because it shifts very quickly with most derailleurs, avoids redundant ratios, provides useful gear progressions, and never drops the chain. I don't find the occasional double-shift to be a significant disadvantage.

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   What works best for you? posted by John W on 9/6/2000 at 7:59:46 PM
I thought I might chime in with a newcomers thought. I have been riding my Schwin LeTour lll for the last seven or eight weeks and have gotten used to the shifting of the stock derailleurs. The derailleurs are labeled LeTour but they look just like the shimano 600's on my Capo. Anyway, the stock Schwin derailleurs seem to me to be great; no double shifts, very quiet in gear once you get the hang of how far to move the shifters, just overall great. I ride between 6-10 miles at a time about 5 times a week.

I do agree that the 14-28 rear cogs are good for us older riders. I think maybe even a little smaller front chainring would be good for me as we have a few hills where I live in Santa Cruz Ca.

I have a couple of bikes, new to me, That I can Briefly compare to my everyday Schwin. I have an old Capo with shimano 600 derailleurs and Campy shift levers I can't shift as well as the Schwin. I expect as I ride the Capo more I'll get better shifting It. Right now I seem to double shift more than I do on the Schwin. The Capo is a very smooth plush ride and the steering geometry seems to be just right for me. That is to say the steering is not at all twichy.

My other new to be bike is a Bianchi, probably Japanese ancestry, That has Suntour Cyclone derailleurs. I really struggle with the shifting on this bike on the rear gears, although the front derailleur is flawless. The road manners of the Bianchi I have to get used to. The steering is very quick, what I would call twichy, and the ride is very hard. I feel every pebble and line on the road. The Bianchi is the newest bike I have so I'm guessing that the newer bikes have gone to stiffer frames and steeper fork angles.

Oldroad bikes are neat and if you get enough different bikes you can ride in any language.

   frame geometry posted by John E on 9/7/2000 at 7:20:27 AM
Yes, subtle changes in frame or fork material or geometry
can greatly affect how a bike corners, climbs, sprints, and
takes the bumps. This is why I have convinced my wife that
I really do need three road bikes: my comfortable old Capo,
my race-bred Bianchi, and my somewhere-in-between Peugeot.

As road surfaces have improved over the years, stiffer,
more efficient frames have become increasingly fashionable,
although many of us in this forum think the trend has gone
too far. We old guys (born on Tullio Campagnolo's 49th
birthday, I hit the half-century mark last month) want bikes
that are fun and sporty, but also practical and comfortable.
I think Rivendell has the right concept.

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   What works best for you? posted by Keith on 9/7/2000 at 7:33:03 AM
A couple of other details. First, the reason you tinker wih the dropout adjusters is to get the right space between the jockey wheel and the 28t cog -- if there's not enough distance the chain will flutter between them. Also -- when in doubt, replace that old chain. New chains are well made, IMHO, and pretty cheap. $10 or less will put new life in your drivetrain. In a similar vien, get a chain scrubber. Cleanliness matters. I don't know about you guys, but I'm not big on wax for bike chains that are ridden daily -- I find I need to reapply it after almost every ride. I use it on my Mercian, however, which I reserve for centuries and longer rides. Otherwise I like Tri-Flow.

MISC:   Allegro posted by: Art on 9/5/2000 at 6:22:37 PM
I have a pretty nice chromed Allegro frame with Nervex lugs. It has no decals at all, just the nice Allegro metal badge. Originally, it appears, the lugs were highlighted by red painted lines that followed the curves of the lugs. I'm not sure what to do with this frame. I've built it up with old campy stuff that I had laying around and I think it looks cool with just the black saddle and black tires. I'd like to show off the lugs....it seems silly to paint the chrome frame, but that's one solution. I test painted some fine black lines around the lugs and while it looks better than the red, it doesn't seem enough. I could go chrome on chrome, no color or pinstriping at all. I'm stuck also on cable color.Black, which I usually use, will stand out too much and break up the chrome lines. I'm not sure about white or gray. I've thought about going cableless, but the bike does sport about five cable guides and I'm not sure about filing them off...I can't justify it. Ever see a chrome bike with chrome lugs? Was there paint on the frame at all? Are there any other ways to highlight the lugs? Any suggestions would be appreciated.

   RE:MISC:   Allegro posted by Brian L. on 9/5/2000 at 11:11:49 PM
Sounds like a beautiful bike. Definitely don't do it any permanent harm by filing anything off. In the big picture, it won't be yours forever and the next generation of rider would curse such a desecration. Besides, once the chrome is gone, what's to stop the rust demon?

I've seen some all chrome lugged bikes that looked great. Paramount with no pin-striping whatsoever, and a Mondia with red lug outlining. If it were me, I'd go with red, and then compliment it with some nice shiny red Benoto bar tape, red cables, red pedal straps, a nice ALE chrome bottle cage, and red Campy shifter covers if you can round up a pair.

   RE:MISC:   Allegro posted by Keith on 9/6/2000 at 5:54:24 AM
My sense of aethetics must be way off. A high school friend of mine rode a chrome Paramount with red-outlined Nervex pros. I STILL lust for that bike -- he still has it too. Plus he was the best driller-outer I've ever seen -- pefectly spaced countersunk holes in everything -- he even did a cool spiral pattern of holes on his bell. But I digress. I'd KEEP the red, and even go with red cable housing, red toe straps, and red cloth tape. Flashy city!!! It's chrome!!! Forget understated!!! So I guess I'm a wild man.

FOR SALE:   Campy downtube shifters posted by: jim on 9/5/2000 at 11:11:56 AM
Broken clamp, shifters in good+ cond. Low-end Campy from late 70's, (not Record or Nuovo Record). Perfect for someone w/ an incomplete or worn out set, or frame bosses. $15

AGE / VALUE:   What do these go for? posted by: ChristopherRobin@stamail.com on 9/5/2000 at 7:36:54 AM
What about is a Campangnolo water bottle worth? pearl and a unique design.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   What do these go for? posted by Art on 9/5/2000 at 1:24:55 PM
$70 on Ebay. $45 from them, according to a post on Bicycle Classics if its the aero bottle.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   What do these go for? posted by ChristopherRobin on 9/6/2000 at 7:38:17 AM
Thank- You

WANTED:   Holy Grail (My Next Purchace) posted by: Keith on 9/5/2000 at 7:09:18 AM
Thanks again for all of your advice!!! Last week I bid on a Trek 620 on Ebay, only to be beat by a few dollars on the last few minutes. It was a great bargain (at least I think so, since I only saw pictures), even though it had a little rust. The whole Ebay thing frustrates me. So after a good deal of thought, and with my wife's encouragement and blessings, I'm actually going to go with a new machine. Forget about the Rivendell, at least until I win the lottary -- the price for frame/fork which was listed as $1,700 on the last catalog is now $2,300. Worth every penny, I'm sure, but not on my salary. Grant Peterson seems all ga-ga about the Japanese Atlantis, and I'm considering that option, though it's a true touring bike, with cantelever brake braze-ons, and I've always prefered single-bolt sidepulls. I'm leaning toward a Heron Road -- it's been out a while, it's built by Waterford, which I trust, and it seems to have the features I want. I'll probably order it through Rivendell and buy Rivendell friction components for it. Any last words of wisdom before I take the plunge???

   Heron posted by John E on 9/5/2000 at 12:19:07 PM
Sounds good to me, particularly the part about the
single-bolt sidepulls, the friction shifters, and the
Waterford pedigree. We will expect a full road test report.

   RE:RE:WANTED:   Holy Grail (My Next Purchace) posted by Brian L. on 9/5/2000 at 11:13:44 PM
Buy the Heron Road (but you'll still want the Rivendell).

   RE:WANTED:   Holy Grail (My Next Purchace) posted by Oscar on 9/5/2000 at 8:29:58 AM
You can buy into the Rivendell aesthetic/philosophy and your wife says ok. What further kick in the pants do you need? Go plunge! I have no doubt that you'll be happy with the Heron.

   RE:WANTED:   Holy Grail (My Next Purchace) posted by Keith on 9/5/2000 at 9:56:32 AM
I just noticed my Freudian slip typo -- Pur-chace. Oscar's right, of course. I went ahead and emailed Grant Peterson directly as to the Atlantis/Heron choice. I half expect him to say something like, "either bike would be fine."

AGE / VALUE:   Bianchi? posted by: John W. on 9/4/2000 at 4:28:33 PM
Well, the Labor day weekend has been good for finding old bikes. The one I need help with is a possible Bianchi. This bike really looks great with it's bright red paint and chrome ends on the seat and chain stays. The name plate on the head tube is a decal that has any eagle? with a crown above the eagles head. There is a name banner on each side of the eagle. One side says Edwardo the other says Bianchi. There are also two decals, one on either side of the seat tube, that say Piaggio. There is serial number on the bottom of the bottom bracket #BS 18512.

Now here is the reason I need help. All of the equipment on the frame is Japanese. The derailleurs are suntour cyclone, The crankset is SR Sakae as well as the stem and bars. The shift levers are Suntour Power. The brakes and levers are Dia-Compe side pulls with drilled levers. The Hubs are Chair and rims araya.

Do I really have a Bianchi or do I have some Japanese bike that has been repainted and Bianchi decals applied? Could it be a Bianchi with a Suntour group for an update? Anyway oldroad bikes are really neat and it is fun tryin to find a real treasure for not very much money. As you can probably tell I am just getting into this old bike hunting adventure. The hard part Is not buying everything I see. So far in two months of looking I have a Schwin LeTour, a Capo, a Peugeot, and maybe a Bianchi.

Any help on the maybe Bianchi is appreciated. I am getting to where I can ride in any language.

   RE:Japanese Bianchis posted by John W. on 9/5/2000 at 5:37:15 PM
Hi John,
Thanks for the input. I just checked the bottom bracket marking and it is 1.37" X 24 TPI". So, I have a japanese Bianchi. The bike rides really great, although it is a little quicker steering than my Schwin.

What do you think it is worth? I paid $50.00. Should I keep the bike and just ride it while I look for a European built bike or consider it a good enough example of a Bianchi. Since I noticed your reference to your Scottish heritage, I suspect I stay with my Japanese/Bianchi.

Thanks again for your help.

   Japanese Bianchis posted by John E on 9/5/2000 at 7:43:56 PM
To me, the issue is not the bike's Japanese heritage, but the overall quality of its frame tubing. If it's something like Tange Prestige II, it's a keeper. If it's plain carbon steel or straight-gauge CrMo, you can do alot better. You may also want to measure the major frame dimensions and compare them against current Bianchi specifications. I am certain it's a more resilient ride than my spongy old 1970 Nishiki.

Of course, if you want something collectible, you will have to hold out for an Italian-built Bianchi, or even move up to a DeRosa, Colnago, etc.

Ciao (or should I say, sayonara?)

   Japanese Bianchis posted by John E on 9/4/2000 at 6:46:31 PM
Hi John,

The bike probably IS a Bianchi, rather than a forgery. However, like most other European manufacturers, Bianchi started having their lower- and mid-priced frames built in the Far East, to their specifications. Yours is either an Italian frame with Japanese gear or a Japanese frame. If the bottom bracket cups are marked "36mm x 24TPI," it's Italian; if "1.37" x 24 TPI," it's Japanese-built. The serial number sounds very Japanese in its location and character series (my Nishiki was KS 78091, and my Bianchi's S/N is at the top of the seat tube).

Great minds think alike. My four operational bikes are a Schwinn (Project KOM-10 mountain bike, not LeTour), a Capo, a Peugeot PKN-10E Competition, and a Bianchi Campione d'Italia Limited.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Bianchi? posted by Warren on 9/8/2000 at 7:56:34 PM
There were varying degrees of quality with the Japanese Bianchis...I had a splendid example with Ishwata O22 double butted tubing throughout, chrome stays, campy dropouts and a Suntour Superbe groupo. Nicest bike I've ridden and I've had a few.

MISC:   SRAM 12 sped internal hub posted by: Tom Faust on 9/2/2000 at 6:26:07 PM
I have been looking around for a SRAM 12 spped internal hub, but find that they hav been discontinued and are no longer supported. That means no parts. SRAM has responded to my e-mail only to say that these were discontinued. Was it discontinued for good cause, or for lack of sales?

FOR SALE:   Bicycle and Parts for sale page UPDATED posted by: VVVintage Vintage Bicycles at OldRoads.com on 9/2/2000 at 4:19:52 PM

We've added more bicycles to our For Sale page.
Click on "Bicycles/Parts FOR SALE" at the top of this page.
On Ebay we've got an old NOS Maillard Dural race kit in it's original hand-crafted wooden box. You can cut-and-paste the following link to see the item (8 pictures)


VVVintage Vintage Bicycles at OldRoads.com

WANTED:   need rear reflector 75 collegiate posted by: marcy on 9/2/2000 at 3:14:38 PM
looking for a rear reflector that would fit a 1975 schwinn collegiate. (mine is cracked) they are kind of raised up and rectangle shaped. willing to buy or trade for old bike light, have one that is a white delta winner brand light, circa 1950s. if you have one you want to sell or trade, drop me an email at marzuki@earthlink.net. thanks. --marcy

AGE / VALUE:   Fuji posted by: racerrex on 9/1/2000 at 8:30:06 PM
Here we go again. Just acquired a Fuji Sagres. Triple butted tubing frame (they call it VALite) Nitto drops, Sugino bb and arms (sugino 75), suntour derail. & shifters, taaaall frame ( 25") (too tall for me). I don't know much about fuji, any experts willing to shed some light on this beauty.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Fuji posted by Brian L. on 9/1/2000 at 9:36:45 PM
Here we go again. You couldn't give it away to most people. I've seen those triple and quad butted stickers, and for the life of me, they seem to weigh as much, if not more than all the other lugged steel frames. Anyway, if it rides well, what the hell. I personally wouldn't mind getting my hands on one of the high-end Fuji race bikes from the 70's. Those were the classiest at my local bike shop when I was a teen.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Fuji posted by Keith on 9/5/2000 at 10:06:03 AM
I think we need to keep in mind that the Japanese did, in fact, produce some very nice, high-end bikes. It's just that what we usually see is what was most common because they were imported by the millions, namely, the low-to-mid-range Suntour V/Sugino/Dia Compe-equiped bike with plain gauge or butted chromoly frame. Although not considered valuable, they are, IMHO, a good cut above low-end European bikes of the time. And, the higher-end models are as nice as their European counterparts in every respect. The Campy-equiped, Columbus-tubed Japanese Lotus I have sitting in my office is a wickedly stiff bike, and resembles a Cinelli, but with cleaner brazing and mitering.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Fuji posted by Keith on 9/5/2000 at 10:14:03 AM
My last post got stuck in the wrong place above this. Anyway, bottom line, there are some truly excellent Japanese bikes out there that we sould be careful not to lump in with the generic low-end Suntour V/Sugino Maxy/Dia-Compe-equiped models.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Fuji posted by Keith on 9/2/2000 at 9:46:22 AM
Ditto. With very few exceptions, there is not interest in these. What kind of Suntour stuff does it have? If it's Supurbe or Cyclone, you've got some good, funtional retro equipment to strip and put on a nice frame that fits you. If it's the run of the mill Suntour V, then you've got your basic $20 garage sale bike. Sheldonbrown.com and cyclesdeoro have short blurbs on Japanese bikes, but I don't think they will shed light on your particular model. Nitto bars are cool -- Rivendell stockes them.

   Fuji posted by John E on 9/2/2000 at 3:19:45 PM
You could do what I did. For $10, I picked up a too-small ('50cm) Fuji that sounds pretty similar to yours. I kept the SunTour Cyclone II derailleurs and downtube levers, Sugino crankset, DiaCompe aero sidepull brakeset, and 6-speed freewheel, and gave the frame and wheelset to a local bike shop, who gave me a $20 credit towards future purchases. They built up the frame with more recent components and resold it at a modest profit. I have made good use of the parts on my other bikes.

Although alot of early 1970s Japanese frames felt very dead and spongy, by the late 1980s Fuji, SR, Nishiki, et al. were putting out some pretty respectable product. However, if the frame does not fit you, you need to find a different home for it. Since it is not a collectible, do not worry about swapping parts around.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Fuji posted by Scott Smith on 9/3/2000 at 1:42:38 AM
Well, I own a Fuji Newest and it rides just great. I'm currently cleaning it up and getting the frame ready for Joe Bell to Imron. ( I'm re-creating the decals on the MAC in vinyl) Can't wait til it's finished.

   Fuji; decals posted by John E on 9/3/2000 at 12:25:52 PM
The computer-generated vinyl reproduction decals sound like a great solution to a problem many of us face, Scott! Where do you get the material? (I would like to generate a new Columbus "Tre Tubi" downtube sticker for my Bianchi.)

What is the approximate vintage of your Fuji "Newest," which I presume is no longer their newest model? During the 1970s, I watched Japanese frames steadily improve in responsiveness. I would have kept my Fuji if it had fit me or another family member.

MISC:   Obsession on New Shorts Part Deux posted by: Oscar on 9/1/2000 at 11:49:58 AM
Remember my post about gel padded shorts? I rode to work in them yesterday, and it was weather here has been Amazon-like. Real sweatty stuff, you understand. The sweat at the bottom had no where to go to, as gel has to wicking power. Nor absorbing power.

In other shorts, if I bottom out on perspiration, the faux chamois draws it away. On the worst day, it'll soak through the saddle, which is gross, but better than the alternative.

My wife, who gave these to me, is a talented seamstress, and maybe I'll talk her into removing the gel, and sewing in a chamois insert.

   RE:MISC:   Obsession on New Shorts Part Deux posted by Keith on 9/3/2000 at 7:14:52 AM
No no no no no no no! NO! Stuff a pair of real shorts in your saddlebag and change into them early on a ride. For purposes of marital bliss I say accept the gift, as is, gratefully. Then buy her flowers.

   RE:RE:MISC:   Obsession on New Shorts Part Deux posted by Oscar on 9/3/2000 at 4:55:11 PM
Ok. Early on when we were married, I returned a tie that she gave me. I had to wait 12 years for the next one.

   RE:RE:RE:MISC:   Obsession on New Shorts Part Deux posted by Oscar on 9/3/2000 at 4:56:28 PM
It was brown with peach colored flowers.