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Archived: Vintage Lightweights

VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Free Gitane Grand Sport DeLuxe Frame posted by: J.A. Collins on 7/8/2003 at 3:29:12 AM
Not sure if this has any value or not, but free if anyone wants to pay ground shipping. Old 70's era Gitane Grand Sport DeLuxe frame, crank, headset. Green metallic color, badge reads Gitane Nantes, Made in France. Head tube about 4", top tube 21", seat tube 20" and down tube 23". It is a fully lugged steel frame. Has some rust on top tube and around one lug area. If junk I will toss it.

AGE / VALUE:   Free Gitane Grand Sport DeLuxe Frame posted by: J.A. Collins on 7/8/2003 at 3:29:12 AM
Not sure if this has any value or not, but free if anyone wants to pay ground shipping. Old 70's era Gitane Grand Sport DeLuxe frame, crank, headset. Green metallic color, badge reads Gitane Nantes, Made in France. Head tube about 4", top tube 21", seat tube 20" and down tube 23". It is a fully lugged steel frame. Has some rust on top tube and around one lug area. If junk I will toss it.

VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Chubei Bicycle Japan posted by: Paul on 7/8/2003 at 2:26:27 AM
I have a Chubei bicycle I think was made in Japan. It is a 27 inch with 18 gears, and a Suntour-Honor derailer. I bought it used over 25 years ago. Any information on where it was manufactured and how to find out what year it was made. What distributor sold them? Are there still parts availble? If so, where?

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Chubei Bicycle Japan posted by Tom on 7/8/2003 at 4:56:27 AM
Assuming the parts are original, you can usually date the bike within a year using the date codes stamped on most components. Fortunately, Suntour/Maeda were were fanatics about date coding their parts. Refer to Skip Echert's excellent Vintage Trek site ( http://www.vintage-trek.com/component_dates.htm ) for locations and decyphering of the codes.

FOR SALE:   CCM Tour du Canada posted by: Alex on 7/7/2003 at 11:15:58 PM
Bike for sale CCM Tour Du Canada

Good shape all campi

AGE / VALUE:   AMF Anerican Eagle posted by: Steven on 7/7/2003 at 2:21:11 PM
I picked up an AMF American Flyer ten speed yesterday after passing on it the week before. It was at a garage sale and he only wnated ten dollars forit, well it was still for sale on Sunday so I rode it and offered him five, we settled on $7.75, we both think we got the best of the other.
It is orange with Suntour 'Honor' derailuers and Dia Compe side pull brakes.
It has a black padded vinyl seat,. I am just wondering if anyone has information on it. It is light weight and rides very nicely.

    AMF Anerican Flyer posted by John E on 7/7/2003 at 2:48:56 PM
Your new acquisition should prove be a simple, sturdy, basic transportation bike; it sounds similar to the mid-1970s Sears Free Spirit I used as a beater. At 35-40 lbs, it is comparable in weight to a Varsinental.

In 1968, the Honor 2600 was SunTour's bottom-of-the-line steel derailleur. By 1976, it had been replaced by the Honor 2310. The Honor probably shifts as well as any other derailleur of the same time period (and better than most of the competition), but it is very heavy.

   RE: AMF Anerican Flyer posted by Dave on 7/7/2003 at 8:47:28 PM
I had one of these that I first used to learn how to rebuild a bicycle. I even Krylon'ed the frame a red color but the bike was stolen about 2 weeks after I had rebuilt it. It was heavy but a good commuter.

VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   kia posted by: mark on 7/7/2003 at 1:33:51 PM
i have a kia with 27 inch rims with all shimano parts just wandering what the value might be thank you

AGE / VALUE:   lotus road bike posted by: bob on 7/6/2003 at 4:39:03 PM
lotus road bike for sale $40.00 700x25c wheels very light bike please e-mail for pictures.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   lotus road bike posted by Jim on 7/22/2003 at 3:02:56 PM
if still available pls send pictures and any info on components, frame that you have. thx

AGE / VALUE:   Raleigh Grand Prix posted by: Dale on 7/5/2003 at 11:38:58 PM
I have a lead on a 21" Grand Prix, which is supposed to be in good condition, though it needs tires. I think he said it still has operational Simplex derailleurs. What's it likely to be worth, or in other words, how much should I spend for it? This frame is too small for me, so I'd only get it if the price was right and I could find it a good home.

I have a long history with the Grand Prix, and really like the model. If I can find it a good home and make a few bucks, I'd go for it.


   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Raleigh Grand Prix posted by Warren on 7/6/2003 at 2:49:11 AM
Not to be negative Dale but you'd have to put a Grand Prix into a time capsule for you to make money on it. If you'd like to ride it then great, buy it. There were too many made to have collectors value.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Raleigh Grand Prix posted by Dale on 7/6/2003 at 5:23:19 PM
I kinda figured. I know they don't sell well locally - I guess that there's no accounting for (lack of) taste.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Raleigh Grand Prix posted by Gralyn on 7/7/2003 at 1:23:34 AM
I have seen Grand Prix's - all varying degrees of componentry, etc. I thought I would like to have one for the "collection" - so I found one - It's a really nice bike - but nothing fancy one frame or components. I haven't even cleaned it up yet. I will clean and polish all the parts and re-assemble - but I just haven't got around to it yet. I know it's not going to be valuable....and it's not in mint condition or anything....but I think it's a good bike.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Raleigh Grand Prix posted by Warren on 7/7/2003 at 1:43:58 PM
You're right of course...there were some better ones out there. I just saw Simplex and thought it wasn't one of those.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Raleigh Grand Prix posted by JONathan on 7/7/2003 at 11:29:22 PM
hi, Dale. I have a Gran Prix from the late '70's that is nothing to hoot about, except for the sporty ride characteristics. However, in the 1973-74 vintage Raleigh "Record Ace", you encounter the Simplex "Super LJ" alloy front and rear derailers; Reynolds 531 butted tubes throughout, Campagnola dropouts (vertical), the AVA stem, Maillaird hf wheels and Brooks or Ideale leather seat. The Gran Prix was a notch higer up in the line, so the components and frame construction would be similar, I would guess. I have a RRA from the late '70's with 20/30 steel tubing, a turn downhill for quality, except the cranks are very good quality. I placed a triple on the front for touring. The alloy wheels are nice, too. The Gran Prix has steel rigida wheels, but identical cranks (minus the granny triple, small chainring). As yours has the French components, I'd check for Reynolds 531 tubes, which may not be evident from a decal, as they come off sometimes...often, I am told. With Reynolds 531 and higher end of Simplex changers with retro-friction alloy levers, you may have a collectible as well as great riding bike....JONathan

VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   10-speeds posted by: bob on 7/5/2003 at 9:09:35 PM
i just got a schwinn 10-speed and im wondering if there is a place i can get the rims straightened back out thank you

   rim straightening posted by John E on 7/5/2003 at 11:10:26 PM
I suggest taking the wheels to a reputable local bike shop and seeking their advice. Minor wobbles and some larger gradual bends can often be corrected, but tight kinks and abrupt flat spots generally require rim replacement. If you have a Varsity or Continental, you can greatly improve responsiveness and braking safety by replacing the original heavy steel rims with more modern aluminum rims.

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   10-speeds posted by Wings on 7/6/2003 at 2:14:05 AM
It is very easy to pick up a used Schwinn ten speed in a thrift store with good rims and then replace the ones on your bike. :)

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   10-speeds posted by Smitty on 7/6/2003 at 5:05:56 AM
Hey Bob ride a Raleigh Grand Prix and you may not care about fixing that Schwinn

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   10-speeds posted by Randy on 7/6/2003 at 11:06:08 AM
Look up Sheldon Brown's article on building wheels. It is well done and that is how I got my start building bicycle wheels(I just started a couple of months ago so it can be done). It seems to me that if you are going to ride a bicycle a lot you would be wise to learn the basics in wheel truing. If that path doesn't appeal to you, Wing's advice is well offered; however, even those wheels might go out of true and you will be back to the same question. I might add that following Wing's advice might turn you into a collector. The easy way - spend your money at the bike shop and just enjoy the ride(I'd bet this is the most common solution).

   RE:RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   10-speeds posted by JONathan on 7/7/2003 at 2:24:12 PM
Examine the rim as John E. suggests; looking for the defects that would preclude repair. I'd get a spoke wrench. You need a spoke wrench just for normal maintenance anyway, so it's a good investment. I would just go to work truing it up as best you can, using the "free" expert instruction. Most general purpose bicycle books will also have a section on wheel maintenance. If you snap a spoke or it doesn't true up, you have at least gained some valuable experience without much expense. Before I got a truing stand, I would adjust the wheel spokes "en situ" with surprisingly good results. Again, it's a question of; "How true do you need to get"? This is best answered by the intended use of the bike, with common sense being a major criterion. IMHO, it's a worthwhile effort to learn the skill, as it will provide better rides and save you lots of $$. Good luck....JONathan

AGE / VALUE:+AKAAoACg-Who can re-dress an Ideale saddle? posted by: humberchristopher28@hotmail.com on 7/5/2003 at 6:42:26 PM
The seats were perfect as I found them. There was green corosive gunk around and on the rivits and some dressing that was crusty around the rivits and so in a moment is sheer stupidity and complete idiotic-ness I scraped the rivits off and scraped the leather clean around the rivits.

Now they are marred and I marred two of these. This is the sort of dumb thing that makes your bike buddies look at you like you are out of your tree. I was not thinking.
If I ever show these otherwise flawless, model 90 Professional saddles one with the duraluminum flat rails and the other with black steel rails, the first thing folks are going to wonder is:
Who was the knumbskull who scraped these like that?

I turned a valuable collector piece into a scraped up mess. This post is painful to write and I hang my head down in shame after looking at what these can fetch on e- bay. I am upset that I did this and am ashamed.
Now they're worth what?

Ok, I have confessed this. My bike pal already read me the riot act and he threatened to come over and relieve me of my other Ideale saddles, clamps, and related things. He demanded to know where I find these and he was in my parts drawers of parts and he wanted some things and he kept a sour attitude and kept bringing up the scraped Ideale seats. The only reason I invited him over was to show it and ask who can re- dress a saddle. I got no answer.
Now I ask:
Is these any way to re- dress these so it looks original and proper? Any way to repair it?
Is this a lost art? He just snorted and stood there looking at me.
The saddle dressing is brown.

One day I would like to see a picture of the Ideale factory and the folks who made these and some sort of expose on Ideale. The day I picked up these seats for 10.00 each and I found a box to take them home in I sat there and held the old Ideale seat to my nose and smelled the awesome peculiar smell that Ideale saddles have and the dude asked in amazement. "What are you doing?"

Ideale seat lovers will understand but I'll bet nobody would ever deliberately scrape an saddle like I did.

Who and where can re- dress this for me so this vintage bicycle saddle sin is permanently hidden from the world forever?
I have other Ideale saddles that have escaped this from happening to them.

This Scot bike has a Lepper saddle# 145 and as soon as I saw it I remember what I did to the two Ideale seats and I thought to myself:
"Don't touch that seat!! you twit! It's perfect."
I own other leather seats of various makes and they are all fine.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:+AKAAoACg-Who can re-dress an Ideale saddle? posted by remorseful Chris on 7/5/2003 at 7:15:39 PM
It's bad enough when a plastic mudguard gets cracked or when something gets damaged by accident but to just sit there and scrape these like this!
These are not cheap or easy to find.
Everywhere now where vintage French bicycle seats are collected,worshiped and sold I'll be reviled as an idiot for having done this.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:+AKAAoACg-Who can re-dress an Ideale saddle? posted by humberchristopher28@hotmail.com on 7/5/2003 at 7:22:20 PM
A quick check on e- bay for the current auctions of Ideale seats has one
Ideale #58 at 200.00 and it is not over yet!
Item # 36166993294

My seat is more mint if it were not for the scraping I did to this.

I'm ruining expensive Ideale seats! Too upset to continue typing!

   RE:AGE / VALUE:+AKAAoACg-Who can re-dress an Ideale saddle? posted by smitty on 7/6/2003 at 5:22:11 AM
I would not trade 5 brooks for my 1 Ideale. I spent 4 days on that baby on PBP 1991. They are worth every penny. I to would like to know more about the co. that made tese fine seats

   RE:AGE / VALUE:+AKAAoACg-Who can re-dress an Ideale saddle? posted by Smitty on 7/6/2003 at 5:33:31 AM
Put those seats back on a bike were they belong and ride them for a year or two and they may be just fine. I like my Raleighs and Bob Jacksons but Ideale seats are the best.

   re-dress an Ideale saddle posted by John E on 7/7/2003 at 8:21:13 PM
You may want to check with CyclArt.com. They have rebuilt, refinished, and/or restored a number of leather saddles.

   RE:re-dress an Ideale saddle posted by Chris on 7/8/2003 at 9:57:46 PM
Perhaps if I anonomously leave the two of them in a little basket with a note.

I'll have to practice saying with a straight face that's believable "I don't know how that happened, really!"
The best thing for me to do is just go out there and find more of these for like 10 or 15 dollars or so. I'll cover these with something and nobody will ever know.
Yes, Cyclart could possible know the secret on how to match the original dyed dressing of an Ideale saddle.

AGE / VALUE:   Peugeot 10 speed "Trophy" posted by: Patrick on 7/5/2003 at 1:56:41 PM
I was wondering if anyone had any information on this bike. I was told it was from the late 1980s (made by Peugeot in Canada). It's silver with "trophy" written on the side of the top tube and has "103" written on the inside of the bottom front tube. It's a 10 speed, with shifters on the bottom front tube. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

     Peugeot 10 speed posted by John E on 7/5/2003 at 11:14:23 PM
Carbolite 103 was Peugeot's bottom-of-the-line TIG-welded carbon steel frame, and, in my opinion, a step backward (and upward in weight) from the lugged-and-brazed basic steel UO-8 frame of the early 1970s. Also, note that the seatpost diameter is nonstandard. Sorry; although I own two Peugeots, I am NOT a Carbolite fan at all.

   RE:  Peugeot 10 speed posted by Randy on 7/6/2003 at 11:16:46 AM
Take a look at the right chain stay for a model number such as UO 6 or UO 8. If that is there you will have better identified the bicycle. I have quite a few different Canadian made Peugeots(UO 6, UO 8 both French and Canadian, UO 10, UO 12) and it seems to me that the higher the number the nicer the bike.) If you e-mail me a picture and component description, I might be able to be of more help. There is not much information on the web about these bikes but this forum is helping to change that.

   RE:RE:  Peugeot 10 speed posted by Patrick on 7/6/2003 at 1:03:57 PM
It has UO 10 printed on it. Do you know when this model was made or what its value would have been? Thanks for the help.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Peugeot 10 speed posted by Tom on 7/6/2003 at 3:51:59 PM
Canadian manufacture of Peugeots started in 1978. The earliest documentation I have mentioning a UO-10 model is 1979. The U0-10 model had disappeared by the 1983 catalogue. Therefore, a Canadian built UO-10 would appear to be from the period 1978 - 1982. The UO-10 was basically the touring version of the UO-09, according to Peugeot literature. The U0-09 was selling in the $200.00 US price range at that time, so the UO-10 would have been priced about the same.

Patrick, can I assume you are Canadian? The reason I'm making this assumption, is that the Canadian manufactured Peugeots were not exported into the U.S.A. until 1983, after the U0-10 had disappeared from the catalogue. Of course, several could have found their way south of the border, but I'm betting that you are a fellow Canadian!

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Peugeot 10 speed posted by Patrick on 7/6/2003 at 11:50:54 PM
Thanks Tom. Yep, I'm Canadian. I happened to pick up the bike at a local bike shop out in the country. I wanted a racer, so the owner showed me this second-hand peugeot (the only new bikes he carries are mountain bikes). He said the previous owner had never used it (just kept it in the garage, for what he thought was a decade, but I guess must have been two decades). It looks brand new. It's in amazing condition considering how old it is. It's a nice bike too (light, handles well, looks great). I guess there must not be many of them if they were only built for a few years, and only for sale in Canada.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Peugeot 10 speed posted by Tom on 7/7/2003 at 12:48:42 AM
Patrick, there were lots of UO-10 sold in the USA, but they they weren't manufactured in Canada, like yours. That's what you clued me into the probability that you were Canadian. They were in a pretty popular price range, so there should be good number of them out there, but not to the extent of the AO-8, UE-8,UO-8 & UO-9.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Peugeot 10 speed posted by Patrick on 7/7/2003 at 2:48:54 AM
If the UO 10 is the touring version of the UO 9, then what is the difference between the two?

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Peugeot 10 speed posted by Tom on 7/7/2003 at 12:13:41 PM
Acccording to my literature, there was not much difference. The basic specs (brakes, cranks, derailleurs, frame material)were the same. The only difference mentioned in the specs are the UO-10's alloy rims versus the steel on the U0-9. I suspect some of the minor components (i.e seat post) may have also been aluminum as opposed to steel, but this is not mentioned in the specs or discernible by looking at the pictures. However, looking at the pictures there are some other minor differences. The UO-9 had stem mounted shift levers and brake levers with safety extensions. The UO-10 had down tube mounted shift levers and the brake levers had rubber hoods in place of safety levers. The saddle also appears to be different. There may be other differences, but this is all that comes through in the specs and pictures.

Frankly, I don't know why why Peugeot literature refers to the U0-9 as a sport model and the UO-10 as a touring. The UO-9 is the logical development of the venerable U0-8 model from the bike boom years. However, the true touring model from the bike boom, the UE-8, developed into UE-18. Both the UE-8 and UE-18 came factory equipped with racks and fenders. Personally, I'd look on the UO-10 as being a deluxe version of the U0-9, as opposed to a touring version. Mind you, the differences appear to be relatively small, which could explain the short life span of the model.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Peugeot 10 speed posted by JONathan on 7/7/2003 at 10:33:07 PM
Thanks, Tom. Not only was your post an informative description; the intuitive conjecture raises interesting points for discussion on these ol' Peugeots....JONathan

VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   10-speeds posted by: mark on 7/5/2003 at 4:26:06 AM
i have 2 schwinn 10-speeds did schwinn make a matching womens bike to these thank you

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   10-speeds posted by Bryant on 7/5/2003 at 11:49:19 AM
Mark, Schwinn made a number of Mixte frame bicycles. You need to give us some more information though, such as model type. An excellent source for Schwinn Lightweight information is the Schwinn Lightweight DataBook at http://www.geocities.com/sldatabook/cover.html

   step-through frames for 10-speeds posted by John E on 7/5/2003 at 11:17:21 PM
The Varsity, Suburban, etc. came in ladies' step-through models, as well as the familiar diamond-framed.

MISC:   Summer Vacation posted by: Tom on 7/4/2003 at 5:05:47 PM
If any of you are planning vacations in the Thousand Islands region of Eastern Ontario / Upper New York State, maybe we could get together. I don't have the big collections that a lot of you have, but we could probably kill a few hours easy. Contact me via e-mail regarding the dates of your expected stay in the area and maybe we can arrange something.

AGE / VALUE:   Water Decals and Shellac? posted by: Wings on 7/4/2003 at 6:23:54 AM
I know this could go in the Restoration section but I wanted your thoughts!

I just installed some water decals according to thel instructions in the Restoration thread (from Hyperformance). After the decals dry thoroughly should one Shellac them?

What are the pros and cons on using shellac as a coating over the decal? Does shellac (I would use clear shellac) really give the decal a longer life?
Is there a better coating?
Or should one just leave the decal alone?

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Water Decals and Shellac? posted by Oscar on 7/4/2003 at 1:54:07 PM
Enamel clear coat would be better than shellac. I think shellac has a satin finish. Your decal won't look very crisp. I also think it will hold up to the elements better.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Water Decals and Shellac? posted by Tom on 7/4/2003 at 2:03:48 PM
Clear overcoats are applied to bicycle frames to provide a more lustrous finish, prevent paint oxidation and protect decals.

There is no doubt that an overcoat will seal the decals and prevent peeling and flaking from normal handling. However, damage can still occur in abnormal situations, if the clearcoat is penetrated.

The question is whether you are using actual shellac as a clearcoat, or are just using it as a generic term for clearcoat? Actual shellac is organic and has the advantages of being non-toxic, inexpensive and easy to apply. It is also UV resistant and non-yellowing. However, it is not very hard and is susceptible to scratches and water stains. It is also easily damaged by alcohols, alkalines and heat. Conversely, the relative softness of shellac makes it easy to remove in the events of mistakes.

To-day, most bicycle manufacturers apply non-organic clearcoats. These clearcoats are extremely tough, but are more toxic, expensive and difficult to apply. You also have to ensure that the it is compatible with the paint and decals, as use of the wrong type may cause damage.

So you can go with shellac which is cheap, easy and provides some protection, or you can go non-organic which is more expensive and difficult, but provides better protection.

The last question to ask yourself is how much value you place on restoring the frame to original condition, versus protecting the decals. Many vintage lightweights would not have originally had clearcoated decals.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Water Decals and Shellac? posted by Wings on 7/5/2003 at 6:49:54 AM
I asked about Shellac because in the past I have read about it covering decals. I have used synthetic shellac for projects (not bikes) in the past and that is what I was considering.

Shellac would not be lacquer based and therefore would be safe on a decal. I question if clear coat (a lacquer) would react with the decal. I guess that is something I would have to try.

The bike was painted and clear coated and has a nice soft shine to it -- not the ultra glossy look. And I have a ton of bikes around here that have decals all over in good shape that were never coated. I guess that I would like to preserve the coat as I plan on preserving the bike. I did consider using clear coat -- it even comes in a spray can, and would be easy to apply to a masked off area.

How are you guys treating your decals when you do a total paint job???

Thanks for the opinions!

MISC:   Born again fixie posted by: Edward in Vancouver on 7/4/2003 at 5:35:34 AM
Finally got my fixed gear project up and running for the Canada day long week end, and gave the bike a 1/2 km spin to the park and back again. At first I didn't think much of it. True, the braking needed some advance planning and co-ordination, but I'd get used to that. And sprinting seemed more powerfull and smoother, but maybe it was just my imagination. No, nothing really to get excited about.

Ah, but when I sat down to watch the news I kept glancing down at my legs: No, they weren't moving, but it felt like I was still spinning perfect circles. Weird... After the first commercial block started I was out of the house and on the bike heading back to the park. Just a short spin, you know, just so I can get that braking sequence figured out...

Oh, by the way, any one know of a way I can rescue the rubber hoods on my Exage levers? They're starting to disintigrate and make my hands black and sticky.

   RE:MISC:   Born again fixie posted by Oscar on 7/4/2003 at 1:50:47 PM
It took me just a few minutes to "learn" fixed gear riding, and then it took me a few rides to appreciate its advantages. I tend to ride faster in fixed gear, I think, because of the momentum. You really lose a lot of speed when you coast - even when you are approaching a lonely stop sign. I also have to view short, steep hills as challenges instead of bummers.