VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   BB axle tapers posted by: David on 4/3/2005 at 2:27:17 PM
Is there any easy way to tell which taper (ISO or JIS) an axle or crank has? Or should I generally match European BBs with European cranks and Japanese with Japanese?

     BB axle tapers posted by John E on 4/4/2005 at 5:06:49 PM
Since the taper angle is the same and the only difference is the size of its outer edge, a good micrometer, or even a precise ruler and a good eye, should suffice. I have never seen a JIS taper in a European spindle, but I have seen both ISO and JIS among various brands of Japanese spindles. For example, I believe Shimano and Sugino have historically been incompatible. When I put White Industries cranks on my son's mountain bike, I had to use an unexpectedly short UN-72 cartridge, because the cranks do not seat all the way down.

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   BB axle tapers posted by T-Mar on 4/6/2005 at 1:46:04 AM
If you're talking vintage bicycles, it's a mute point. Just about every manufacturer had their own standard when it came to the end width and length of the taper. In some cases there were even substantial variances between models! As long as the back of the crankarm mounting hole does not bottom out on the on the wide end of the taper and the narrow end is slightly countersunk to extractor hole, then you should be OK.

AGE / VALUE:   whats it worth? posted by: dave on 4/3/2005 at 12:10:31 AM
i have a schwinn le tour luxe in a greenish color all orig.
stored for years. needs tubes and toe clips missing.
any ideas?


VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   1985 Trek 770 posted by: Evan Smith on 4/2/2005 at 10:25:50 PM
A 1985 Trek 770. I don't know to much about this bike. Use to be my fathers. If anyone knows the info on this bike could you tell me pls. Im looking into selling it and wondering how much i could get for it. A picture attached to this:


   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   1985 Trek 770 posted by JONathan on 4/3/2005 at 6:27:58 AM
Try "Vintage Trek" site. There are complete listings of models and years and I think some catalogs with prices.

   Can't help you with a cash value, but I have to say -- posted by Elvis on 4/6/2005 at 10:32:52 PM
-- that is a VERY nice looking bike. Wow! It looks to be in especially great shape for one it's age.

As the man said, the vintage treck site is the way to go, but I just had to say it's an awesome ride!

-- Elvis

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS: 1985 Trek 770 posted by Vincent on 4/7/2005 at 12:41:58 PM
I have a 770 that I purchased sometime around 1985. It's a nice, tight frame. Mine was made w/531P tubing and was silver brazed. As nice a bike as it is/was, I don't know if it has significant intrinsic value (other than to a Trek afficianado) given the features available on new bikes. My suggestion, if the frame is sized for you, is to ride it and enjoy it.

VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Raleigh Grand Prix posted by: Gralyn on 4/1/2005 at 2:28:06 PM
My 3rd Raleigh Grand Prix!
I have hit the local thrift stores off and on over the past several months. For the most part - nothing. I have had the feeling that for me, it's basically "over" so far as being able to find old halfway decent bikes and fix them up. There has hardly been anything at all for a really long time. So, on Wed. I spotted a Panasonic X-3000, or T-3000, or TX-3000....something like that. It was too tall....but it had a really attractive price....and it had some halfway decent alloy components.....but, it was already sold.....someone had grabbed it up! Then yesterday - I spot a Raleigh Grand Prix. It looks to be about a '74 model - just like my other ones....and this one is red. Now, I have red, white, and blue Raleigh Grand prix's.
The red one has rigida chrome rims with QR hubs, Wrights leather saddle, simplex shifters and front der. I suppose it's all stock. It looks like it will clean up really nicely. The rims look like they will clean up well also.
Currently, the white GP is all completed. The blue one has not been re-assembled yet. I think what I'll do is dis-assemble the red one - then clean and polish all the components....then re-assembly both the red one and the blue one.....then take some pictures of all 3 of them. I will probably sell them at some point. Hey, if someone is interested - they can choose their color: red, white, or blue!

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Raleigh Grand Prix posted by JONathan on 4/1/2005 at 5:22:44 PM
My 2 GP's are blue. One is early '70's, dark blue with European components, wrap-around seat-stays and a fairly long wheelbase. Large rear clearance and relaxed geometry makes for a nice glide over rough spots. This would be typical of European designs, IMHO, to accommodate cobbled-stone roads and all-around riding conditions. The second GP is a light blue (sky-blue) frame without wrap-around stays. Tighter geometry, especially in the rear triangle. This one has exclusively Japanese componentry; SunTour, Dia-Compe and SR. It handles briskly enough for cruising. Probably about 1978 build, from what I've seen in the Retro-Raleigh pages. The interesting difference is the frame weights. Without a direct scale comparison, just hefting the two bikes off the deck, the earlier GP seems very lightweight.
The later one is 2030 tubing. The stickers are gone on the earlier build, so I am wondering about the frame tubing. The early RRA's and GP's had Reynolds 531, I think. At some point early on in the bike-boom the tubing was swapped to 2030, like the "Sports" and "LTD's". I really can't detect any subjective ride differences between the '70 "Record" and the earlier GP. Both bikes run real smooth. It appears to me that the later frames lost some of this quality...or is it just my imagination coupled with my inordinate interest in old stuff? The paint on the early versions has heavy primer coats it looks like to me. Wax really enhances the vintage aspect. Real cool looking bikes. I agree the English and French bikes are diminished in numbers. I have not seen one in a while, based on random checks. I gave up about a year ago, besides having too many to work up as it is. Good luck.

   RE:RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Raleigh Grand Prix posted by Dick in FL on 4/2/2005 at 3:52:52 AM
If you are still wondering about your GP's tubing spec, mine still has intact decals that say 2030. It has the wrap-around seat stays, c.p. brakes, blue & black paint, and cottered cranks. (Do your later models have cotterless cranks?)
I bought this thing 3 years ago at a thrift store for $5 just to get the accessories which included a charming Sobitez bottle generator and light kit and classic spring loaded parcel rack. This bike has the original tires and handlebar tape both in good shape, but I'm not into downtube shifters after doing a century with them. So I committed heresy and cannibalized the GP for its red 'R' nuts. Shameful, I know. Now, with all this GP talk, I had another look at her .... better than anything cuurrently at the thrift store.

   RE:RE:RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Raleigh Grand Prix posted by JB on 4/2/2005 at 6:44:07 PM
Picked up a white Raleigh GP several months ago..was attracted to its ornate lugs, and long wheelbase..use it at work to commute between two worksites. Another cyclist rode it yesterday (younger triathlete dude)..loved its geometry but pronounced it a "beast."..weightwise. I love the monster..has Weimann/Carlton hoods..Simplex gears..and real meaty Michelin I said a very solid "big" feel..the city roads I travel are replete with winter chuckholes now...the GP plows ride over/through. And, once geared up and rolling...sails right along..Yeah, I think I'll keep first Made in England ride (I'm and old francophile)

   RE:RE:RE:RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Raleigh Grand Prix posted by JONathan on 4/2/2005 at 8:52:11 PM
Dick, my '78 GP has cotterless branded "Raleigh" SR cranks and branded Suntour derailers..looks like the sturdy "V" series on comparison with a straight-named SunTour "V". The performance improved at the expense of what was called; "big-bike" feel of the earlier steeds. My '70 has Nervar cottered cranks with Huret down-tube shifters coupled to the standard Huret derailer found on low-enders.
I changed to a "V" on my big yellow '70 "Record" along with alloy Araya 27" wheels and Kool-Stop salmon color pads. Now, that made a huge difference in ride. I can get up to cruise speed real quick. Passing "modern" lightweights is a trip. However, when someone comes along on a carbon-frame who really can ride, well, there is no contest there. Strictly comfort and ruggedness is what I get. Also, I feel like a champ when riding the Bridestone RB-1 after spending all week pushing the "record". 31#'s is a decent weight for commuter work on rough surface running, IMHO.
The early geometry is way better for long rides from my comparison. The '78 came stock with chromed wheels which was a strange choice, considering the alloy cranks were stock. I would rather have alloy wheels and cottered cranks than the steel wheels with alloy cranks. Just my opinion.
Although most home mechanics would find the cottered setup a big negative.

   RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS: Raleigh Grand Prix posted by marc on 4/3/2005 at 6:46:43 AM
I doubt the grand prix ever had reynolds tubing, at least officially (I'll explain that in a second.) I had a very earl 60's gran sport pre raleigh swallowing up Carlton, it had campagnolo gran sport derailleurs and shifters, brooks swallow saddle, red GB brakes, and a sticker of Sir Raleigh himself proudly proclaiming it 2030 high tensile steel. I'm not 100% but I believe this was there top model at the time or at least near the top so I if their campy equipped model wasn't reynolds I doubt the grand prix was. I loved that gran sport but it was just too big. I sold it minus the seat for what i paid for it but then the buyer insisted on me selling him the swallow, I only asked for 20.00, that was before I saw how much they fetch on ebay.

Now as to my curious statement earlier, this may or may not apply to the grand prix, I was told that many of the bikes that were supposedly only built with main tubes of reynolds were in fact all reynolds. It was just a matter of using what was available and since raleigh bought things by the boat loads, those reynolds stays and forks had to be used somehow. Whether this trickled down some where to the record, gran sport or not I'm not sure. the best way would be to check the seat post diameter. 27.2 for reynolds 531, and 26.4 for reynolds plain guage 531. I just sold a falcon frame I built up into a single speed because it was too big for me. It was plain guage reynolds and a blast to ride.

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Raleigh Grand Prix posted by Kurt K. on 4/3/2005 at 2:48:44 PM
Hmm, you fellows are tempting me to buy that white, NOS Grand Prix frame at one of the LBS...

Take care,


   RE:RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Raleigh Grand Prix posted by Gralyn on 4/4/2005 at 7:52:20 PM
The GP is heavy. I stripped it down yesterday. A lot of steel componentry!...and steel wheels, too. Oh, the red one - still has a license sticker that expires in June of 1974. Of course - it has the wrap-around seat stays, steel cottered crank set, steel ders, steel seat tube, etc.
I'm thinking about maybe building up the blue one with alloy components - as opposed to so much steel. I think on the red one, though - I will go all original.

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   Raleigh Grand Prix posted by chris kennedy on 4/10/2005 at 1:24:04 PM
i just picked up 87 grand prix with full shimano 105 and reynolds 531 tubing at a yard sale for 40 dollars teal color and near perfect

VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   motobecane team champion posted by: BikerTex on 3/31/2005 at 4:21:07 PM
I have a classic '70's era Motobecane race bike (I think it was called the team bike or champion, or something like that) in good condition. I bought it years ago when I worked in a bike shop, with intentions of restoring it. Just wondering if anyone knows where I might be able to get more information on the bike. The bike is a sort of dark orange color, with all Campy Nuovo Record parts, and the frame has a decal on it indicating it was built in Italy. Anyone have any info on this old beauty?

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   motobecane team champion posted by Eric Amlie on 4/1/2005 at 1:25:57 PM
I think you have Moto's top of the line bike for that period. I've seen it mentioned, but don't know much about it. I'm sure others will chime in with more info, otherwise you might post it to the Cycles d'Oro Classic Rendezvous list. I think that is where I saw it dicussed. If you query the archives there you will probably find some info also.

   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   motobecane team champion posted by David on 4/1/2005 at 4:31:30 PM
My mid-70s Moto brochure has a pic of all-orange Team Champion (no chrome dropouts) and following specs:
21 lb
20,21,22,23,24,25" frames
Reynolds 531 DB
Campy dropouts
Prugnat lugs
Campy chromed fork tips (?)
Campy Record headset, brakes, NR der, seatpost, 42-53 crank
Cinelli stem & bars
Unicanitor saddle
Campy low-flange hubs
Super Champ rims w/tubulars
Regina 13-21 cluster

Nice bike!


   RE:VINTAGE LIGHTWEIGHTS:   motobecane team champion posted by Rance Hamstrung on 4/7/2005 at 12:55:33 PM
I bought a 72/73 Motobecane Team Champion (reads "Champion Team" on the frame) about 15 years ago from the original owner. What caught my eye about your posting was the "made in Italy" decal. This doesn't sound right. This was Moto's top race bike from the period, apparently imported to the U.S. on a limited basis. Hand brazed in France. This bike was the production model of the bike Luis Ocana rode to TDF victory in the 1973 Tour, the year he finally beat Eddie. Was it the year Eddie got punched in the kidneys? My bike, I think, is the first version. It has bright orange paint, beautiful, small, understated black lettering in a stylised script as opposed to the large, clunky block lettering used shortly thereafter by Motobecane. Full Nuovo Record group with patent 72 rear derailleur, Brooks Pro saddle, etc. I received two catalog scans from that era from a nice fellow in Illinois, I think, who is a Moto collector. These helped me date the bike, sort of. Mine has half chrome front fork and no chrome on the rear stays or dropouts. I think Harris Cycle has some info about the bike on its website. The Team Champion was said to "be made by other hands" when compared with other Motos of that era. I love my bike. I mounted a pair of VELOFLEX Roubaix tires on it last summer and WOW! What a ride. Its no Cinelli but exudes oodles of retro-French charm! Write me if I can be of any help. I'll try.