AGE / VALUE:   Pierce Arrow posted by: Phil & Jen Rewa on 5/27/2007 at 1:49:04 PM
We recently became owners of a Pierce Arrow bicycle and were looking for Age and Value of the Bike. It is a Ladies bike with Firestone Speed cushion tires with white walls 24 x 1.75. The bike is Blue in color and has crome fenders front and back with Pierce arrow plates under handle bars and under front part of seat. It is also labeled Pierce arrow on the chain guard.
I can e-mail pic's of you wish.
Thanks for your help.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Pierce Arrow posted by john on 5/29/2007 at 1:31:38 PM
I have a Pierce track racing bike circa 1939. Pierce Arrow (the car company) stopped making bikes in 1918 and sold the bike making business to Emblem Company of Angola New York at that time. I guess to get away from copyright infringement, Emblem labeled my bike Pierce followed by an arrow symbol(not the word arrow). If your bike was made by the car company and is original, it most likely would have wood rims, single tube tires, and have skip link chain or be gear driven. If you google Pierce Arrow bikes you can find additional info including images of the car company headbage to see if it looks like yours. I don't know if other companies just used that well known name in later years. I believe bikes actually make by the car company are quite rare. Hope this helps. john

AGE / VALUE:   Hercules Tourist posted by: DJ Stamp on 5/27/2007 at 9:29:36 AM
I have a Hercules Tourist with serial number PO 3414 stamped on the rear dropout. There is no date one the Hercules 3 speed rear end. It has a brass Hercules head badge. Any idea of the vintage of this bicyle?? Sorry about the other post I accidentally posted in the for sale section - it's my first time. DJ

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Hercules Tourist posted by Bryant on 5/29/2007 at 5:44:25 PM
You might want to try posting on the English Roadsters forum. Although if your bike has a Hercules 3 speed hub, that would put it before 1960. That is when Raleigh bought them out and Sturmey Archer Rear hubs were used from then on.

AGE / VALUE:   Mystery Miyata bike Part 1 posted by: Chris on 5/26/2007 at 7:49:51 AM
Garage sale find. $10.00. I looked at it and said yes.
Three chain rings in front, loved that really small one. Got to dreaming about this drive train in my soon to be modernized (mucked with) 50's Reg Harris Lenton Sports
I'm wondering if I can pull out the crank and put it into one of my Raleigh's. Three gears in front one rather small. But I'm noticing the frame is constructed to allow this. Not so on the Raleigh's that were meant for 3 speed hubs.
Got to find my crank puller too. Oh, this is a nutty idea and it might fit and be heaven and likely will not fit and this is trial and error. Had a brown Miyata 210 in my teens and it was a marvelous bike.
This bike is way nicer!
I'm going to part it out. I looked at it and looked again..... But wait...... This is a complete and very nice bike! cantileaver brakes, a front fork with two sets of eyelets for front racks and fenders! Handlebar end fitting shifters. Precise accurate marvelous gears, it's a 21 speed or higher. 700 c wheels.
Wait! This is too nice to part out in some crazy project that likely will not work. What do I have here? I can't remember the model number but I may have a diamond. Looked at Miyata bikes on e- bay today and they go quite high. Miyata is an old company and they made a lot of things some high end some lower end. I'm encouraged by the canti brakes. The bike is far too nice to have it's cranks removed for another bike.
Miyata is a well made decent bike. Japan made. So what's my problem? I don't know their history. A very decent bike a real moder treat but I'm not bitten by the Miyata bug. How many folks get bit and have a stable full of varoius Miyatas? If you are thinking I should have left it there, you are 1/2 right! Somebody more knowledable and a Miyata fan who would ride it as is and appreciate it might have come up the drive.
Japanese bikes as well made as they are don't excite me. No magical patina or romance as with the British or French stuff from decades past.
No room to take it to the jumble sale and today it's raining and I can't do that without finding out it's general value. So part 2 of this post will reveal what it model it is. From there, with dilligent and patient research I'll know just what it is I have. Gee, I might even find a buyer and make a buck or two off of it. I don't go for the possibility of making money. I enjoy the first few moments when I see it from afar and don't know what it is until I get out of the car and up the driveway. Then I get to examine it and then the part I hate. Asking what they want, weighing the price, haggling, having to turn it down many times. The thrill of discovery. I love the cobweb covered, dusty, slightly- rusty treasures. I dislike almost all the new stuff. New bikes are looked at for their parts that will by some slight chance fit my old stuff and give me a better ride. Many people don't appreciate the older collectable stuff and I don't generally appreciate the new stuff. Stay tuned for part 2 where I tell what it is. I'll take measurements and describe it properly.

I'll ask to trade it for an old 3 speed British bike of lesser value.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Mystery Miyata bike Part 1 posted by Roger on 5/26/2007 at 8:38:30 AM

The old Yahoogroup: hoping nothing objectionable has found it's way there.

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Mystery Miyata bike Part 1 posted by JONathan on 5/27/2007 at 3:01:23 PM
Sounds to me a lot like my Miyata "six-ten". It is a superb touring (steel-frame) bike. Picked it up for a cool $60, which I felt was a bit steep...until I rode it. WOW, it is well worth it. Real nice riding. I recommend giving it a spin, before deciding to parts it. There was a model above the "six-ten", which differs mainly in componentry. Nice find.

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Mystery Miyata bike Part 1 posted by David on 5/27/2007 at 6:45:47 PM
I think you're gonna find that the Miyata BB is BSC (24 tpi) and the Raleigh is Raleigh-threaded (26 tpi) and they ain't gonna interchange!

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Mystery Miyata bike Part 1 posted by Chris on 5/28/2007 at 6:35:22 PM
OK. Part 2 What is the general value??
Please advise me.
It's a Miyata 618 GT Splie tripple butted. 18 speed dural front fork eyeletts, dual water bottle braze on screws. Sansin sealed system mans bike blue with pink accents. 700 x 32 C wheels. SR SP -155 ALLOY SAKAE ENHANCED OVALTECH XCM
Suntrour accushift rear derailer XCM 3040 xcm suntour Dia Compe brakes ( quick release wheels, cantileaver brakes)
Miyata radial 700 x 32 C Spenco gel Avocet seat. Greenfield kickstand.
San Sin sealed system
canti brakes are directional type.
I rode it. It totally flys. Gearing is utter perfection.
I am open to offers. Who has an old British 3 speed bike to trade for this?

   RE:AGE / VALUE:   Mystery Miyata bike Part 1 posted by David on 5/29/2007 at 5:12:13 AM
Chris - you know as well as anyone that the only way to determine value is to sell it! Are you asking for offers?

   RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Miyata 618 GT posted by Chris on 5/29/2007 at 7:57:53 AM
Yes, I guess I am asking for offers. Trying to get a general idea of what these go for and trying to feel out what it is that I found.
Offers will be somewhat under what these go for.
The bike totally flew and the gears are the best I have ever ridden.

It is original, as found but if I do keep it I will change the handlebars to something where I don't have to lean over. Sit up and beg handlebars are my favorite.

Chris- Back in favor with the gods of Garage sales, estate sales and kerb finding it seems.

   RE:RE:RE:AGE / VALUE:   Miyata 618 GT posted by Chris on 5/30/2007 at 3:52:25 PM
originally a $400.00 bike. Found a stem that fits so I'm not leaning over. Will keeep original bars. Still want to sell it but may end up making this a daily rider or daily driver, as we say.

MISC:   Unique Front Derailleur posted by: Roger on 5/25/2007 at 5:17:59 PM

I've certainly never seen anything like this.

   RE:MISC: Unique Front Derailleur posted by John E on 5/29/2007 at 8:25:50 AM
That is a Simplex Competition "suicide" shifter, which was very popular through the 1940s and 1950s. The companion Tour de France rear derailleur is a low-normal (reverse-action) bandspring unit with upside-down cage action (tension wheel next to cogset). Schwinn used this combination in the inaugural year (1960) derailleur-equipped Varsity and Continental, because the Huret brothers wanted $1.27 more for the vastly superior-in-every-way Allvit rear and companion cable-driven front derailleur combination.

I tried out a high school friend's suicide-shifter-equipped Schwinn Continental and found I greatly preferred my more modern and familiar cable-driven front shifter. Ironically, an original suicide front shifter generally significantly increases the value and collectibility of a 1950s road bike.

MISC:   How much Lighter??? posted by: Roger on 5/24/2007 at 10:09:18 PM
I wonder how much less a current rear wheel with say a six speed gear sprocket is compared to a vintage one of say, a six speed rear hub of 1980? That much of a difference?? Just for your ordinary road bicycle?

   RE:MISC:   How much Lighter??? posted by David on 5/25/2007 at 5:08:00 AM
You could easily calculate it. My guess is that the main diff will be between the new cassette hub and the old freewheel hub. The new wheel probably has fewer spokes, too. Many websites give the weights of the new components. Add 'em up.

   How much Lighter??? posted by John E on 5/29/2007 at 8:16:31 AM
Reduced spoke count wheels actually require heavier rims than traditional 32- or 36-spokers. I doubt today's wheelsets weigh significantly less than the best of the 1980s; the biggest change has been in frameset weight. Unless you are racing professionally, a kg or two of extra frame weight is inconsequential.

   RE:MISC:   How much Lighter??? posted by Roger on 5/29/2007 at 7:33:07 PM
Thank You to both of you;

I was in a bike store today and held some of the new clusters for a few moments; and had a few preliminary thoughts, lighter, but maybe not that much more than some from yesteryear.

My question was earnest, dang loaned out a bike and never got it back. But that is some months ago, so I've kind of gotten over it; but it was a Maillard set up; that I held dear, I will say that. The other names escape me too, the freewheel but it was worthy. So these things happen and we learn lessons.